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i have never owned a proper suit so here i am looking for some type of guidance haha.....
i need to get a suit together for a bunch of upcoming events, i dont think i want to go as far as purchasing a tux but the suit i get still has to be something entirely formal.
please give me your suggestions on what style/cut/material etc i should consider, and where in sydney i should look at buying. cheers :U
"Formal" = black tie = dinner suit / tuxedo.
Anything else is "business" or "lounge" suit.
If you don't want to buy one, your best option might be to hire a formal suit as needed. A rule of thumb is 10 events or more, and you're better off buying.
I had to go to a wedding recently and I had no kit, so I popped down to Vinnies @ Brookvale and scored a nice double breasted suit, some contrasting beige pants, a shirt, a nice plain belt, a pair of black leather shoes, a pair of black socks, and a silk tie with Fred Flintstone & Barney Rubble on it (that got me heaps of comments :2tsup:). It was all in top condition, cost me less than thirty bills all up, and I walked away with a good feeling that I'd helped out a worthy organization, and recycled some unwanted gear. :)
You can get silk grundies there as well, but my 'boys' won't settle for hand me downs. :wink:
Are the events in question considered formal or black tie? If so there are two options.
If you are at the point in your life where you expect that your waistline has finished growing and you can see more formal events in your future, the purchase route is the better choice. When you own your own tux it is so much less of a hassle to go to these events.
If you don't have the spare funds for a tux purchase, there is a sneaky way out. A black suit may be the simple answer. The suit needs to be BLACK, BLACK. Something that would be appropriate at a wedding, funeral, Sunday go to meeting, Christmas Dance or just in the office in that high rise building. This suit with a formal (tux) white shirt, cumberbun and bow tie gives the appearance of a tux. Unless someone actually looks at the suit label, they will not be able to determine that you are wearing a suit and not a tux. I've done this on several occasions.
Of course shiny black shoes complete the tux.
Come on,
seriously, what sort of event demands a formal dinner suit/tux these days?
you are better off buying a well cut, black or very dark grey business suit.
should cost min $800.
a quality dinner suit costs a lot more and you wont get the wear out of it.
Or go to a small church run, OP shop in a medium weathy suburb. the stuff dosent get centally distributed like the big charities. so whats donated in the area gets sold in the area its donated in.
This dosnt work so well in rich suburbs because the ladies and gents here like to get their money back and sell their stuff in recycle shops.
Believe me this works.
Style-single breast, side vents in pure wool is classic that wont date
A bit like the little black channel frock for blokes
Astrid:U
PS check the seat of the pants for shine(they shouldnt)
Lots. I've been to four this month, and one more to go.Quote:
Originally Posted by astrid
If an invitation says "Formal", or "Black Tie", it is bad manners to wear anything other than a dinner suit.
I went to a dinner last year where the invitation stated Formal Black Tie and I went to the trouble to hire the necessary attire only to find when I got there several guys were dressed in black or navy Jacket with grey flannel pants. Nobody seemed to worry about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Dunn
and in my opinion its bad manners to demand in this day and age the people either spend a heap on somthing they might wear twice, or hire a crabby looking suit that looks like you cant afford to buy one.
or just plain pretentious
Astrid
Seriously, black tie or formal just means a neat suit.
No, I don't think so.... black tie means what we all know it means. Just go and rent one. Else, like Rich says, go buy one and look after it - they don't date.Quote:
Originally Posted by astrid
No, it doesn't. And it doesn't help the original poster to give bad advice.Quote:
Originally Posted by astrid
Perhaps you don't get out much, but simple good manners should guide you to comply with your host's request for dress. And as for turning up in something else, you'll get away with it once, but unless you've got something else going for you to overcome your lack of taste, you're not likely to be invited for a second chance.
hilux, why would you ask a bunch of woodworkers for formal dress advice? That's like going to www.vogue.com.au and expecting sensible advice on rust removal from cast iron table tops.
'cause we is intellygent, sufistycated and well edykated.:D
I disagree there are formal dinners and other occasions that you need a dinner suit for I think that sometimes you still need to show some class some style, its like a lady going to the melbourne cup without a hat , its just not done :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by astrid
Hilux I dont know where in sydney but rundells in newcastle do a good range from about $150 upwards, an other alternative is suit hire companies, they renew their stock every year or so , try ringing them ( yellow pages ) and ask if they sell ex-hire suits, the third and option I would suggest is to go to phukett or bangkok and get one made the good thing about this is you get a holiday as well as a new bag of fruit :2tsup:
But whatever way you go buy one , you may only use it once twice or three times a year but if you store it properly you will still be wearing it for those two or three times in ten years time a clasic dinner suit never goes out of fashion.
we could get snitty here but acting like the lady that I am we wont?
Many pleb types think that adding "black tie" to their invite. elevates their select soire to sqatter status.
however in the citys we tend to take a more lenient attitude to some of the poor relations we are obliged to invite to our select entertainments and merely request that neat non revealing attire is worn.
Sadly however, some of the pretentios upstarts in our village dont understand the subtle request. and seem to think that thongs (not the footwear ) can be clearly visible.
Ah me, Nobless oblige.
countess von astrid
But seriouly Guys,
1.you cant buy a decent suit formal or business for $150
2 If you dont own any suit at all, you need one and a good one
3 Armani, Zegna make excellent timeless suits for about $1000.
It has to be black, no pin stripes this implys strengh and confidence
4 To advise a guy with no suit to waste his money on a dinner suit is rather thoughtless
5 any people who judge you on your dress, if you have taken care to respect
their request the best way you can, arnt worth knowing.
manners dont come out of an ettiquett book, they are inate
Astrid
I bought my formal suit for $170 from Roger David, with a shirt and bow tie thrown in, and got a 20% discount for paying with Amex on a promotion.
It's crap, but I only wear it in the dark anyway. I've never been to an event that required wearing a formal outfit without someone sloshing something on me during the night.
I keep my good clothes for less sulubrious occasions.
P
:2tsup:
To advise a guy with no money to buy a timeless suit for $1,000 is probably a bit thoughtless too.Quote:
Originally Posted by astrid
If you don't have a suit now, you won't be wanting one again until your kid's get married or they're scratching round looking for something to bury you in.
There's no such thing as a timeless suit. Just last year's $1,000 one.
I wish I could find Zegna for $1k, up here you couldn't get a shirt for that!
cheers,
P
yeah but a guy needs one good all occaision suit.
In my experience funerals come up more frequently that black tie dinners.
(maybe it's my age)
and you'd feel like a dill wearing a dinner suit at a funeral.
Dont know anything about the would be wearer. but you can wear a good black suit to a formal dinner, presentation, award night, job interview, funeral,
wedding, christening, or in court!
A good suit always is value even if you wear it for ten years.
With double cuffs and cuff links.
and a silk tie!
the rule for dress the same as WW is Quality not quantity.
But we know that most guys over 45 cant buy clothes:U
Thats wht they let their mums (or wives) do it for them:oo:
Astrid
Well as a well dressed woman (when I want to be) that is myHO
Great spiel astrid but you have never been a well dressed male and never will be ,Quote:
Originally Posted by astrid
just like a woman needs one good all ocaision dressQuote:
Originally Posted by astrid
yeah right like a woman would have one good all ocaisional dress and wear the same thing to every wedding funeral etc etc , get real
men do need more than one outfit , and I don't know who you deal with or where you live or your social commitments but I for one do not wear the same outfit for every thing ie to every lunch , job interview , formal occasion , marrige, etc etc
to me it seams you are trying to defend your earlier statement
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Why not just admit you are wrong , the majority of commentrs disagree with you and are from blokes who have a better sence of dress for a bloke than you do, :cool:
If invited to a "black tie" or "formal" function then I wear a dinner suite. If invited to a coctail party or similar the invitation is invariably "lounge suite". I am happy to show respect for my host and comply and do not think it appropriate to tell them I think they are upstarts by wearing something else. If I thought that then I would decline the invitation and not go.
However the invitations I cannot stand are "smart casual". With considerable effort I can fake "smart" but it is not casual and my casual is definately not "smart" as I have a tendency toward being the unmade bed type when in any form of casual attire.
If buying a dinner suite it is best not to go for anything too stylish The new single brested one I bought two years ago is not all that dissimilar to the one I used when at university (just bigger, better material and a lot more expensive). The same cannot be said of my other suites (except size, quality and price) colours and cuts vary considerable over time.
where do you guys learn about the different types of suits?
whats the difference between a dinner suit, lounge suit, formal suit and all that crap?
I have one suit.
Just a regular suit, nothing extraordinary, very dark grey.
To add to that, a blue shirt, a white shirt and a couple of ties.
I have worn it maybe 5 times in the last few years since I got it, and when I did wear it, I did not feel under dressed. Once was a funeral, a couple of job things, a meeting with someone and a wedding.
Only the wedding really specified a 'proper' suit, but since I was family, I got away with it. That, and my family knows that if I don't like something, I walk out the door. I was not the worst dressed there, but I did stand out. Unavoidable, and here, perfectly acceptable.
If, by chance, I really needed something a little more flash, and my wife asked (not pleaded, we get along much better than that), then I'd either hire one, or run over the road to the suit place and grab what they had on the cheap.
If possible, I'd also look into the other bits that go with the suit, as they can add points for when the suit isn't quite up to scratch, in business and some event type things that is, not something really formal.
Good shiny black shoes. Make sure they fit well, are not obnoxious and are thoroughly polished. If they don't fit the above description, you will regret it one way or another.
Any suit jewellery should be neat, attractive and in good order. Be it a pocket handkerchief, a pin or cuff links, they need not be mega bucks, but they should be neat and pleasant. If you can't afford it, simple and cheap is usually fine, gaudy and expensive usually isn't.
A simple wallet can help. Not your every day thing, something simple and enough to hold some cash and other incidentals. It should not show to the outside world.
Leave the phone at home, or at least in a jacket pocket, and keep it quiet.
Keep enough keys on you to get there and home again. A big bunch of keys is as tacky as a ringing phone.
A decent watch. It need not be something worth more than your car, but it should again be sensible and not obnoxious. My dad gave me a watch, it tells the time and goes tick-tock. Silver in colour and it's perfectly acceptable. My grandmother in law also gave me a watch, it too tells the time, goes tick-tock and is gold in colour. It's more than acceptable, since it matches cuff links and most pins better than silver ever will.
This isn't my list, but one I have picked up along the way by folks who know more than I do, and have attended more of these kind of events than I ever will. A lot of the time a pleasant presence is more important than the clothes, but the clothes should not be the weak link if it is avoidable.
There is going to be difficulty in not looking like a black sheep if you are not used to wearing formal gear, but take heart that half the people there probably feel the same way, and so long as you look presentable (if cheaply dressed), and up to standards, nobody who really matters is going to get upset.
Oh yeah, make sure that whoever you buy the suit off actually measures you up and makes sure the thing actually fits. Nothing worse than squirming about in a suit that looks a million bucks, and feels like $10 of barbed wire.
I guess that's more commentary on going somewhere than a suit, but since I don't wear a suit very often, I can't really say what will fly and what won't.
(Or, you could do what a mate of mine did and get a purple suit. He can make it work any time. I sure as heck couldn't ;) )
This might help you Stirlo.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_tieQuote:
Originally Posted by ss_11000
As you get older you move in different circles of friends and clubs where a certain attire is required.
Of course some never get out of the singlet and thongs set.:D
Now, with my origins back in the sub tropical climes of Bonnie Scotland I still wear a kilt on occassion, and for formal occassion wear a Princes Charles jacket with Jabo and a dress seal skin sporran, that is as close to timeless as you can get.
Very formal and has been in vogue for a couple of hundred years, just hate the sheilas who want to put the hand up the kilt though:wink:
Your regular suite is a lounge suite, if it is dark or pinstripped it may be termed a business suite - see http://www.theage.com.au/news/style-...696979890.html for some hintsQuote:
Originally Posted by ss_11000
A dinner suit is technically not a suit. It is a dinner jacket, black in winter and white in summer though not many people bother with a white one as you can wear a black jacket any time of the year. Dinner jackets are generally more simply cut than proper suite jackets as they used to be what people wore every day in elevated society when they changed for dinner.
A Dinner jacket is worn with a dress shirt (one with pleates or ruffles), a bow tie, cumberbund, and shiny black shoes (often patent leather) and cuff links.
The trousers are black and often have a silk tape down the outside seam and normally do not have belt loops.
If you buy a Dinner suite it is really a dinner jacket with matched trousers.
Usually black tie does not necessarily mean your tie must be black but it must be a bow tie.
If you are ever invited to a white tie function (extremely rare so as to be almost obsolete) you must wear a white tie and tails.
The most formal dress you will probably ever be involved in will be as a member of a wedding party where the bride wants the party in tails. This will not apply to the guests.
Formal is not really a style at all but really an invitation to dress up very smartly often by people who do not know the difference or as in the wedding where the wedding party will be dressed up and would like the guests to dress in a formal manner. Lounge suite and tie is appropriate for these as a Dinner Suite or Tux is never worn during the day but at and after Dinner.
It is not all that hard really.
thanx for the info and pusser
I can relate 100% to that. there's a few times I've had occasion to show the tartan. :BQuote:
Originally Posted by Iain
Apart from that, in my books "formal" is any time I'm required to wear shoes... :~
I just make it a rule to never go to anything that states "Black Tie" as such events have a habit of boring me s**tless. I'm not really a small talk person.
It's worse if the event is offering 'entertainment', as I find that more often than not, it'll be something pandering to baby boomer tastes, meaning I'll have zero chance of enjoying myself and I will spend the evening getting more and more unsociable and grouchy.
Black Tie = Just Say No.
I attend one a year for the society of explorers, we meet once a month and have a formal dinner/ladies day in March or April.
The Ladies enjoy the day out, it is a lunch affair that goes on until about 5.00pm and an opportunity for us to show we are gentlemen and able to conduct ourselves as such, the monthly meetings take on a different format though and the rude joke is the order of the day.
It is a hangover from our military careers and all members are ex commissioned officers and the same rules apply, and I recall the RAAF formal functions with the dress uniforms, cumberbunds, sword etc.
It is an experience/exercise to remind us that we are refined and can behave accordingly.
the all purpose black suit sounds like a pretty good option to me...
so now its just a question of where to buy? how much to pay?
How much do you want to spend?
Go to david jones and get the best you can afford.
they have a good range without rubbish and the sales are on:U
Astrid
I thought this site might help with the various different types of formal wear.
Go Formal
Personally, if I were to only buy one suit, go for a black or dark charcoal single breasted dinner suit. Make sure it's good quality and it will last you for a very long time.
Be wary of the cheap 2-4-1 deals. I've found them to be badly made and never last me very long after a few cleans.
Good luck!
Ye God!
There are people and there are people.
I own a few business suits for the rare occasions I need one for work and since about 18 I've own a dinner suit. I hired one for a school formal but had so many other engagements shortly after that it was good money to get one.
And the social engagements haven't stopped. I seem to wear the dinner suit about four times a year and none of them are unreasonable requests.
If you're not in the social circles where dinner suits are common then perhaps you are not really in a position to comment. Of course I agree with you if a person doesn't use it often enough then hire is the best option. But to slam everyone else is a bit, y'know, bad mannered.
Gosh,
your one of the right sort,
simply must add you to my inner circle.
However one must concede, that in these sadder times, one is somtimes obliged to cross the great devide and mix with, and heaven help us, even invite the GU to our little Do's.
One simply must be sensitive to those with HIP's.
Countess Von Astrid
:)
Gday Hilux,
I spottedf this link just before but there are plenty of options on the web now for buying a well made suit: http://www.onlinesuits.com/index.html
I haven't used them myself but a colleague just bought 3 from them and they did a good job. Fabric price is excellent and for the same fabrics you'd be paying double here.
Pusser, I always thought that white dinner jacket was either outside or shipboard?
Cheers,
Al.
I have 3 made to measure suits made 17 years ago still going strong.
1 charcoal. 1 charcoal herringbone. I light charcoal chalkstripe.
Rule 1 Black suits look terrible - the stuff of salesmen, funeral directors, football players and waiters/hospitality staff.
A charcoal/grey suit would be the go-everywhere option.
Rule 2 Always wool, never polyester.
Rule 3 Make sure it fits. Too baggy is definitely out.
cheers
I wore suits every day for about 15 years up until I stopped doing the corporate thing. Always wore off-the-rack business suits that were well made and always wool or wool blend (but not expensive - brand names don't mean much to me). One secret, I always have the trousers lined front and back to the knee. Makes the trousers last at least twice as long without getting shiny, and feels a lot more comfortable. If the shop you are buying from doesn't have an alteration service that can do this for you, I'd find another shop to buy from!
When I married SWMBO I had a suit tailor made - a dinner suit, but with a frock coat instead of the normal length thing (frock coats hang down to knee level). This has served me very well indeed, I've worn it to quite a few events and it never fails to win me admiring comments. I've never found anyone who didn't like it. I had it made out of very good cloth, by a traditional tailor, and it still cost less than an off the rack Zegna.
If you're going to a one-off, rent one. I agree that if the invitation says "black tie" that means a dinner suit with the trimmings. I rented one a few times when I was in the UK and didn't have mine over there, and as long as you find a good rental place, you can get one that is comfortable and well made. I had to rent one for a mate's wedding recently (I was best man and had to wear the suit he wanted me to wear), and the shop that I rented it from were very accommodating. Another tip - if you are trim taut and terrific, single breasted is the go. If you are a few pounds over fighting weight, double-breasted works better (IMHO).
And funny, I usually find black-tie events quite good fun. The booze is usually good and free-flowing, and the tucker is usually OK as well..
BigAl which country are those http://www.onlinesuits.com/index.html suits shipped from?
Remember, without pictures it didn't happen!