help with my render finish....

hi all, I am thinking of rendering my garden wall, however, I am in doubt to which finish would be best? I am going to use GP grey cement about 6 mm thick. However, I have been told to use a plastic float to get a smooth finish. I normally would just trowel off the cement, wait a while and then use a sponge to get a texture finish. I tried the plastic float but it just ripped into the cement, I tried again, each time giving it more time to dry and still the same result. I even waited over night and tried it in the morning same result!!! Where am I going wrong? at what stage should I use the plastic float? Any advice would be appreciated thanks

Chris.

A half an hour to an hour's drying should do, then you have to toss a bit of water on the render with a brush before you float it.
I'd like to see you float it after leaving it overnight. :hahaha:
Are you using a straight edge, and filling the low spots, or are you just after a cowboy job?

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Originally Posted by tobyabe

hi all, I am going to use GP grey cement about 6 mm thick. Chris.

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Am I missing something here?, are you using straight cement or a cement sand mix.

John.

Hopefully you are talking sand & cement.
Make sure your wall is nice an moist before you apply it. this prevents the wall from sucking the moisture out of you render so it will stick better.
Try using a foam float instead of plastic.
If you still cant get it bag render it and pretent that was the effect that you were after all along.:wink:

We'll probably never see tobyabe again. I'm surprised at the number of noobs that sign up to ask a question, and then just off.

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Originally Posted by Bleedin Thumb

Hopefully you are talking sand & cement.
Make sure your wall is nice an moist before you apply it. this prevents the wall from sucking the moisture out of you render so it will stick better.

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Certainly wet the wall first so it's damp, but don't just hose it then throw the render on. The surface should be damp, but free of any water film.

I'm surprised that no one has written a guide to rendering here in the rendering forum. I can't find anything on line either. I'm no expert but I've done a bit of rendering after watching the pros. There's no mention here of hard wall plastering with slaked lime either. It's quite common in high end architectural houses, and often used for setting a concrete ceiling.

Plastic floats are for acrylic render.You would be better offwith a polystyrene float.In fact, you woul dbe better off using bagged acrylic render.It sticks like the proverbial to a blanket.

Tools

hi ya Tools - quick question

regards acrylic render are you thinking something along the lines of the blue circle uni-render (i think that's its name)? - anyway the stuff that is initally hard to mix water through - tends to 'pool' above the mix and makes like a film

what about a wood float - i've found it works pretty well for the type of finish tobyabe is after (i.e. garden wall)

I have just finished the front fence of our property, building up the brick columns, and then rendering/bagging the columns plus the low brick walls between them. I have also previously done our 13' x 6' boundary wall near the pool.

We simply used either the "Render It" from Bunnings, or the "Rockcote Quick Render". Simply wet down the wall, mixed the render with water and some "Lanko Bondit" to help it stick to the wall. Used a metal plasterers trowel to spread upwards onto the brickwork and obtained a fairly decent smooth finish. The wife prefers the textured finish, so she finished it off with those sponges you use to wash the car about 30 minutes after I had trowelled it on. This of course would depend on the weather, and if it was being done in direct sunlight or not. Found that if she tried the sponge when it was too fresh the texture was too rough, and if she made the sponge too wet it would take the render back off.

Now about to install framework between the pylons and install horizontal battens similar to a security screen.

As a side issue, I have also installed a video intercom, post box etc. If anybody wants any suggestions, prices etc on video intercoms just let me know, as I think I have investiagted every possible video intercom type in Australia. Ended up going with of these http://www.dorani.com.au/vdp.html.

Anyhoo, in response to one of tobyabe's original questions, I used a metal plasterers float, and it worked a treat.

Kev

Joister, yes that is the sort of thing I am referring to.When you mix it you need to mix it mechanically as you can't mix it properly by hand.There should be no film on top when you have finished, but a uniformly mixed paste.There are many brands around...unitex,multitex,crystaltex,granotex etc etc

Tools

Hi Guys,
I am intending to do some rendering later in the year when I move into our house in Brissy. Have any of you guys taken photos whilst doing it, or a before and after as I believe a picture speaks a thousand words.

From what I have picked up off websites and this forum it seems pretty straight forward to do. I plan to set the batterns up about 1 - 2m apart to get a fairly even render. Is this a standard thing to do, or do the pro's do it by eye?

Cheers
Steve

Ok mate, this will make it all simple for you. Buy premixed render in a 20 or 25kg bag. A bag will do 3-4 square metres and cost 10 -16 dollars. Follow mix directions and make to consistency of toothpaste or slightly wetter. Do not add anything to it. Hot day, wet wall half hour before. Next trowel on mixture from top down using rectangular trowel. Make reasonably smooth and keep it thin on the wall. Don't worry about those raised ridges, they will disappear in second coat. Do whole wall working left to right or vice-versa. A couple of hours later you can use the edge of your trowel and scrape back the major ridges. Don't be too pedantic, just the bigger ones. Time to do second coat. Mix slightly wetter than first coat and apply in same manner but really apply as thin as possible. 1mm really. You need to purchase either a base render float (plastic with diamond markings on the under side or a poly styrene float.(I don't think bunnings sells the appliers. If you want cheap render and tools for the job go to insulcon in dandenong and pay cash.) Work with two people. One trowels very thin, the other (when it goes off - you remember - when the shine goes) presses and rubs in circular motion from top down, working the mix using gravity to leave any excess on the ground. This takes practise, so do it in the hidden area first. You will have to do an entire 'face' of wall in one go. Two weeks later you can apply top coat or just paint it with long nap roller. Post if you want top-coat info. (I render other people's property so I know what's going on.)

Don't worry as Pawnhead predicted Tobyabe has left the building, infact Pawnhead has been a bit quiet for a while........

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Originally Posted by Bleedin Thumb

Don't worry as Pawnhead predicted Tobyabe has left the building, infact Pawnhead has been a bit quiet for a while........

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Bleedin,
Mate I appreciate this information and so will others that do a search in the forums at any stage in the future. Mind you it is frustrating when people ask a question and are never seen again.

schwerdty,
Thanks for the tips, I will refer back to this post later in the year. I am now moving to Brissy in May, so plan to start some reno's soon after :)

cheers
Steve

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Originally Posted by pawnhead

We'll probably never see tobyabe again. I'm surprised at the number of noobs that sign up to ask a question, and then just off.

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Come on now... I signed up last night to ask the 2-5mm joint question in the same forumn group. Now, I'm doing a bit of reno around the house I'll probably have a few more question here and there, but I only do this stuff on the weekends so I can hardly offer any advice to other users. Now... if you've got a question on why your website isn't scaling, or why the hell this forum software is doing this or that odd bug, I'm your man (and I do contribute to other forums on the subject). Everyone has their areas of expertise, it's just that for this noobie at least... brickwork, concreting, paving, rendering, etc is not MY area so I can not really recontribute all too much HERE.

So... please... keep the hate off us noobies... but do rest assured that we do greatly appreciate the help you are all so willing to lend! Thanks for sharing your area of expertise!

Hello Schwerdty,
I'm interested in your final step on rendering. As you have provided good advice, I thought I may as well do the job right, even though I have already made a mistake with Bond Crete, thanks jamjar.
PS. Would you ever use Bond Crete in your render mix, as I find it makes the render like butter and easy to apply, cheers

I don't think anyone's having a go at NooBs in general. But when the original question still indicates "Posts: 1" it's clear they've taken the info and run. Common courtesy suggests a word of thanks, and I don't think such added posts would overload the forum storage.

Just my 1.5 cents worth.

Joe

Jamjar,
Final render can be done in two ways.
1. Paint the wall with a thick nap roller and exterior semi gloss. A very nice finish and cheap for the appearance. One coat is enough if the paint is of reasonable quality.
2. Acrylic render. Many brands, all do the same thing.
First, mix well then on a very cool day or at 6am before it gets warm, You have to apply it with your trusty steel float (rectangular flat blade) very thinly and literally drag the float's edge across it to remove any excess. You'll get thje idea when you do it. Your helper (impossible to do on your own) immediatley floats (presses and rubs in circular motion) with a red hard plastic float. These are very recognisable. Get it at same store as acrylic render. Float from top down using gravity removing all swirl marks as you go. Be pedantic and you will be amazed at the result. Remember, two person job, one applies, the other floats. Work right to left, top to bottom if you are right handed. Try somewhere small if you can first. Never need bondcrete. It is money poured down the proverbial. All render mixes do the job as well as they need to.

thanks for the tips schwerdty

spotted more of your wise tips on another thread

as mentioned others find all this information excellent when they scroll through

what do you think of the bondcrete question - i've been playing both with and without in the mix - does seem to help in the application - been going for a 10 to 1 mix

definitely not including it on the walls - althought i have painted it on and then rendered straight after whilst it was still moist - didn't find it made much difference - found that keeping the wall moist just with water using either a pump spray or little hand spray does the trick to help the render stick - also good to stop the moisture being sucked from the mix