Tradesman's Tools

A building at my son's school is being converted into a hall.
There are a number of tradesmen working on the job.
Consequently, there are usually four or five cars with trailers behind parked on the grounds.
Walking past to pick up the lad today, one of these trailers was open and inside, were piled a stack of those plastic boxes that you buy power tools in these days. The top one was branded OZITO :eek:

I thought Ozito were cheap crap? :confused:
So what's a tradesman doing buying one? It'd have to be a very rarely used tool to justify buying cheap rubbish surely. :cool:

Any thoughts?
Am I maligning the great brand Ozito?

Richard :confused: :confused:

They are throw-aways.
Quite often used by tradies because in some cases it is cheaper to replace a budget tool than have an expensive tool repaired.
It takes minutes to go to bunnies and by a new POS.
If a name brand tool is being repaired it can take weeks, plus you need to replace it for that time.

Or he could just be tight and buy crap for no reason :)

Cheers, Jack

Could be he's had half a ute load of tools flogged in the past and thus decided to use throw-aways instead. I've seen a lot of blokes buy cheap stuff for use on certain jobs where tools walk, and save the good stuff for home use or their own jobs.

Richard, many moons ago when I was a building contractor, we used to use the good old alloy B&D saws. Now when one of these monsters died it used to cost about $95.00 for a rewind, which was a lot of dough in the early '70s.
Then out came the infamous Skill brand of saws which you could pick up for about $22.00 if you bought 10 of them. Yahoo! when one died you just took out the blade and threw the saw to the shirthouse.
Maybe the chippies work on the same theory today. :D

I think it depends on the tool. I would never buy a cheap tool where precision was required (like a drop saw or router, for example) but I did recently take a punt on an Ozito random orbital sander. I figured that it can't hurt the job and the worst that could happen was that it stopped working or burnt out. Given that I only paid around $30 and had a warranty it seemed like a reasonable gamble. Same theory as buying home brand food I guess -- I wouldn't buy home brand soup, but would buy home brand sugar (because sugar is sugar).

As a working chippy I can verify that fear of the tools being knocked off are the most likely explanation. Whilst I've never stooped as far as Ozito, I have purchased 2 GMC tools. Only use them on "high risk" jobs though. ;)

Maybe it's an expensive tool in a cheap case? Potential thieves might not stoop so low to take that brand after glancing at the case - but if they only knew what was really inside....

thieves dont discrminate, they steal whatever they can!!!!!!!!!!!

He has a fear of tools being stolen and yet leaves the trailer open. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by DanP

He has a fear of tools being stolen and yet leaves the trailer open. :rolleyes:

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Hi Dan,

The same thought crossed my mind. Why bother with any kind of "deterrent" - it that's what it was... and leave the trailer open.

In any case, whilst we discerning lot (!) probably wouldn't want to besmirch our reputation with such a low-end brand (just kidding http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com...ons/icon10.gif), would a thief know 'A' from 'B' - or care?

Also, if theft from construction sites is as much of an issue as it would appear, would a tradesman's insurance cover such losses, or are the premiums just too high? My curiosity on this is because I'm looking at arranging some specific shed 'n contents insurance (as opposed to just simple home and contents). Any thoughts or comments anyone?

Cheers!

Go to any Crime converters store and have a look at all the Ozito and NRG stuff. The crooks deal almost exclusively in this stuff coz no one cares about it. It is easily stolen and they get about $5 for it brand new.

Dan

"They" will steal anything.

I am amazed at what lenghts ppl will go to steal a bird cage perch, no, seriously.
One old woman tried it on just recently.
I have had my eyes opened in the last 12 months.

Al :(

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Originally Posted by Auld Bassoon

Also, if theft from construction sites is as much of an issue as it would appear, would a tradesman's insurance cover such losses, or are the premiums just too high? My curiosity on this is because I'm looking at arranging some specific shed 'n contents insurance (as opposed to just simple home and contents). Any thoughts or comments anyone?

Cheers!

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Premiums and excess are a great deterent from insuring ones tools of trade. Then there's the lost time having to report any thefts to Police because typically the insurance won't touch any claim unless the theft has been reported to Police. Add all the costs and the claim has to be a bloody big one to make it worthwhile.

Mark.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DanP

Go to any Crime converters store and have a look at all the Ozito and NRG stuff. The crooks deal almost exclusively in this stuff coz no one cares about it. It is easily stolen and they get about $5 for it brand new.

Dan

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Hi again Dan,

When I was living in Canberra a few years ago, I went into a c*** converters store, and was amazed at how many 'nearly' new (aka virtually untouched) tools there were there. I recall buying a Makita 100mm angle grinder, a Bosch (green - i.e. hobbyist rather than pro.) hammer drill and a Bosch (also green)orbital sander for a total of under $100. I wonder...

I still have them all, and they all still work perfectly well, some seven years on.

Interesting to note your name for this (franchise?) - are they really a latter day pawn / crook shop? I guess that that the 'goods' have to have an outlet somewhere.

Cheers!

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Originally Posted by DanP

He has a fear of tools being stolen and yet leaves the trailer open. :rolleyes:

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The value of the (lost) time used to open and close the trailer every time you need something, quickly exceeds the value of crap tools such as those described. Hard to appreciate by those who are paid by the hour. :)

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Originally Posted by Auld Bassoon

Interesting to note your name for this (franchise?) - are they really a latter day pawn / crook shop?

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In a word, YEP.

I would say 50% of stuff put through the books would have shady origins. Crooks don't even bother to use aliases when selling.

Dan

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Originally Posted by Auld Bassoon

Also, if theft from construction sites is as much of an issue as it would appear, would a tradesman's insurance cover such losses, or are the premiums just too high?

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I looked into this a few years ago:
Premium = 10% of insured value
Only covered for theft if taken from locked toolbox inside locked vehicle
Theft on site not covered

Prohibitive premium, unrealistic requirements ( so I've got to have a locked toolbox inside my tool trailer or make a lockable canopy on the ute to get cover), ridiculous exclusions (time spent on site about 60 hrs per week, time spent travelling and out about 20 hrs per week, rest of time locked in shed at home) meant that I'd be paying about $3K a year to protect against theft while driving or parked at the shops. I bought a savage dog instead. I also used to have an electric fence unit rigged up on the tool trailer :eek:

Mick

I'd say all of the above could be true.

Some tools, who cares what the heck it is. I used to use the $2 bunnies hammers on the job. I think we buried at least 10 of them. Still cheaper than losing a single Estwing. Also buried a few angle grinders (all cheap crap), plenty of tape measures and knives and a few pairs of pliers along with other various bits and pieces.

When it really hurts (and becomes really stoopid) is when some lowlife scum (concreter, and I know who it was too) knocks off a 6 month old Panasonic 12V drill. The drill. Just the drill. Leaves the charger plugged into the power box, the case with it and the extra battery there as well. Luckily, I was able to offload the batteries and charger for a few bucks, but still had to come up with about $500 to replace the drill. Being a sparky, battery drills is one tool you don't cheap out on. Did it once, big mistake.

But on things like that, you do buy the good stuff because you use every day and you use it hard. A cheapy will not deliver even 1/10th of a decent one. An angle grinder or a hammer, they be dumb tools so cheaper the better.

Doesn't mean I didn't have a variable speed Metabo 5" grinder hiding somewhere though...

If it's because the chippy is a cheapskate, then I wouldn't trust him to build a doghouse. If he's been knocked over a few times, then he needs to pay more attention to how he works. If he just has the case, then his theory might be working. ;)

But we won't know unless he tells us now, will we? :D

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Originally Posted by Schtoo

If it's because the chippy is a cheapskate, then I wouldn't trust him to build a doghouse.

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I disagree. We as woodworkers are chasing a high degree of accuracy and that is why many of us purchase top of the line tools (although these alone do not produce good results)
A chippy in the construction industry works to different tolerances and more often than not a high degree of accuracy is not required.
Obviously there are times a chippy will need to be accurate and that is why you won't find a good chippy without a Makita SCMS stashed somewhere.
On many construction jobs cheap tools will produce the required results so why risk the expensive ones.

I am an Electrician / Refrigeration Mechanic so I don't have the luxury of going cheap on my work tools. As Schtoo said, sparkies can't afford to scrimp on a cordless drill (I also use a Panasonic), and anyone who trys to save a dollar on test equipment is an idiot. As far as fridgy work goes there are some cheap tools available but they are so bad they would make ozito compare to Makita.

The average chippy probably can't afford good tools because he spends all his money on work clothes, have you seen how expensive board shorts are these days. :)

Cheers, Jack

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Originally Posted by DanP

He has a fear of tools being stolen and yet leaves the trailer open. :rolleyes:

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Saw a tradie's ute parked outside the pub in Orange NSW. Looked like a mobile blacksmith, with welding gear + all sorts of expensive stuff, all locked up like Fort Knox. Unfortunately, he'd left his keys hanging in the door :eek:

Then again he may have been 8' tall and only 17 stone, and watching his ute from inside the pub with a few of his mates :D

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Originally Posted by journeyman Mick

I looked into this a few years ago:
Premium = 10% of insured value
Only covered for theft if taken from locked toolbox inside locked vehicle
Theft on site not covered

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*Theft on site not covered*

It's ridiculous, iniit? Of course, in my experience this is exactly where 90% of my tools are knocked off (by other tradies) and where I want coverage.

In the long run, it's proven cheaper to tell 'em to shove their insurance and only buy "bottom-of-the-range" trades quality gear. By "bottom-of-the-range" I don't mean hobbyist tools, I mean tools that'll do the job and last for a while but aren't at drool level. :D

Less gear is knocked off now, the odd occasion is more some bloke "borrowing" it and leaving it elsewhere on site than someone saying "I want." And it has worked out much cheaper to replace this gear than to pay the premiums. Sad, but true. :(

Of course, the tools that don't leave the shop... now that's another story!

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Originally Posted by AlexS

Saw a tradie's ute parked outside the pub in Orange NSW. Looked like a mobile blacksmith, with welding gear + all sorts of expensive stuff, all locked up like Fort Knox. Unfortunately, he'd left his keys hanging in the door :eek:

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AFAIK I've only ever had one thing knocked from the ute. 'Twas (and is) full of orange coloured gear (no names will be mentioned) and the item that was knocked off? A slab of beer. :( Some people have no sense of value... thank god! :D

Trick I saw one bloke do to try & 'scare off' the crooks after he had lost an outboard off his boat while it was tired up at the wharf.
He taped the lid on with duct tape & then painted a brand new 45HP Johnson dull pink with a 4" paint brush.:rolleyes:

I had an older model PC come in to be "re-programmed".
I asked some questions & got some vague answers.
Customer said they had replaced the HDD themselves but couldn't "re-program" it.
It was an IBM & should have a recovery disk so I asked if they had it at home.
I got another vague answer that meant they didn't or they would have run it themselves.
I pulled the lid off for a quick look, it still has it's original HDD but it has been 'cleansed'.
The HDD has been wiped clean & the Model/Serial No. sticker has been reomved from the computer.
I suspect it may have had a 'past life' elsewhere. :rolleyes:
I'm going to run it by the owner in the morning & see what they have to say about it now. :D

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Originally Posted by journeyman Mick

I looked into this a few years ago:
Premium = 10% of insured value
Only covered for theft if taken from locked toolbox inside locked vehicle
Theft on site not covered

Prohibitive premium, unrealistic requirements . I also used to have an electric fence unit rigged up on the tool trailer :eek:

Mick

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Mick, recently got the same answer from my broker. On Monday I went through the Flinstone Trailer (so named because its so badly rusted out). After the $2,300 QuikCut, $700 Rotary Hammer, $1,800 Laser and $1,100 mixer there was only about another $10,000 worth of gear. If somebody knocked off the whole trailer I'd get $500 for the trailer (less excess) and nothing else....But the trailer is a POS worth nothing:D ...geez I'm ripping those insurance guys off aren't I:rolleyes: .

I always tell my offsider , if I die on the job make sure to park the Bobcat on top of me before the cops come because SWMBO picks up the loot if I'm shifted off my mortal coil in an accident directly related to the use of the machine.:rolleyes: :D I love insurance.

Somewhat more seriously, I'm constantly on the guys backs to not leave tools lying around the site. Some of the hobo's working in the industry these days will take anything. I only buy the best tools I can afford and expect to have them for years.

Cheers

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Originally Posted by Jack E

The average chippy probably can't afford good tools because he spends all his money on work clothes, have you seen how expensive board shorts are these days. :)

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Dunno about the board shorts, ;) but on the occasions when I've worked for a large company on commercial construction jobs it really irked me that I got the same hourly rate as a plasterer or a tiler when my dropsaw was worth more than their entire tool collection. Carpentry would have to be the most expensive trade to tool up for but the return isn't any better than the other trades.

Mick

Jack, buying cheap stuff is fine, heck anyone on the tools for a living doesn't always buy the very best unless they have waaay too much spare cash. It's drawing the line that defines cheapskate and being economical.

It's why I had 2 $7 Jaycar multimeters floating around in the tool box, but a $400 Fluke locked in the glovebox. The cheapies did the job most of the time (checking lamps, inconsequential voltages, etc.), but when it counts, the real tools get unpacked.

Most of the chippies I worked with used mostly good stuff, but when it was something they didn't use much and didn't need the best, then they saved a buck.

Heck, we used to give them our old pliers sometimes for a couple of stubbies. Once they don't cut cable anymore, practically useless to us, but virtually any other trade can keep using them for years.

What I meant by cheapskate is buying all cheap junk and working to the standard that cheap junk limits you to.

I like dogs more than that. ;)