Fire safety in sheds

During my visits to sheds to assess dust extraction systems I noticed many interesting things about sheds
Some sheds were kept clean and it was obvious that fire risk was something that had been seriously considered by the owner/operator
OTOH some sheds were serious fire risks and I often did not see anything that would suggest that fire risk had been even thought about.

Anyway I'm not suggesting we need to be doing all of the things mentioned on the list but given the season I thought I would set up this poll as a shed fire awareness exercise and if it helps prompt someone to do something about their situation then that makes it a worthwhile exercise.

So the poll is: Which of the following fire safety measures have you implemented in your shed?
Please note you can check more than one response.
However, as I have no way of specifically locking these out, so if you check the first OR second response you should not check any of the others

Thanks for the responses so far.
Please feel free to add any other categories I may have missed out to the list via a post.
Hopefully it will be of use to some folks.

Thanks to all who are responding to this poll

I see we are doing well on fire extinguishers, cleanups, and ready access to escape routes.

One thing that concerns me about these polls is that they tend to draw in those that are already "converted" to an issue, maybe because they feel they can tick many response boxes?

I have deliberately left the responses anonymous so no one need feel like they are behind the 8 ball on this.

Thanks again to all who responded.

35 members have visited this thread but less than half responded - I wonder why that could be?

Maybe the topic is not "hot enough"?

Bob I read the post only to see what it was all about as you advocated the abolishment of the polls, and wondered why you changed your mind. :?

For the record I don't participate in polls as the only polls I participate in are the official elections, be it local, state or federal.

Peter.

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Originally Posted by Sturdee

Bob I read the post only to see what it was all about as you advocated the abolishment of the polls, and wondered why you changed your mind. :?
For the record I don't participate in polls as the only polls I participate in are the official elections, be it local, state or federal.
Peter.

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Thanks Peter.

Maybe I wasn't clear enough but what I was referring in that thread to was not the "abolishment of the polls" but whether we really needed a poll only forum, particularly since no one seems to be using use it.
I think poll type threads would be more useful if they were embedded within the relevant forum, for instance this one would sit far better and also be far more visible if it was in the Safety forum than in this forum.

Keep a separate bin for metal rubbish vs wood/paper/general rubbish

Separate work areas for wood and metal

I remember in his woodturning tutorial video Kieth Rowley said words to the effect that his insurance policy prohibited him from having hot metal in his woodworking shed - I cant remember the exact quote.

Bill

Hi,
Although my fire extinguisher is AB:E, size wise it is as adequate as my 1Hp dusty with 4 " ducts.
I have had a couple of looks at this post before voting and will pop in from time to time to see how it going and as I assume others have/will do the same so you will have to devise a diversity factor to compare voters to those that chickened out.

Attachment 305147
Regards

Thanks for the suggestions Bill.

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Originally Posted by steamingbill

Keep a separate bin for metal rubbish vs wood/paper/general rubbish

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Unless you are referring to have somewhere to put pieces of hot waste metal I'm not sure what this means in regards fire.?
I reckon the best place for something like hot piece of waste metal is maybe in something like a bucket or container of water.

There is also the need for some place to air out oily rags rather than dumping them straight into a bin. Usually I hang these up outside so they are not all scrunched up and can get plenty of air.

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Separate work areas for wood and metal

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Good point but I was hoping "Shed construction and fit out to suit activities (i.e. all metal bench for welding)" would cover this aspect

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I remember in his woodturning tutorial video Kieth Rowley said words to the effect that his insurance policy prohibited him from having hot metal in his woodworking shed - I cant remember the exact quote.
Bill

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Interesting point.

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Originally Posted by A Duke

Hi, Although my fire extinguisher is AB:E, size wise it is as adequate as my 1Hp dusty with 4 ' ducts.

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Good point, size, suitability (and location) of fire extinguishers are important.
I have a 1kg FE near the back door and a 2.3 kg FE and fire blanket located by the front door of my shed (OTOH I do have a 20+kW mains gas powered forge that that needs special precautions)
Fire blankets are cheap but they can save a lot of mess when fires are small.
I had a discussion with a fire inspector at work about the location of fire extinguishers - I wanted ours to be near the likely source of fires in the labs whereas regs required at least one to be near the entrance doors - and if we really thought it necessary another one near a likely fire location. If you only have one it should be near the door.

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I have had a couple of looks at this post before voting and will pop in from time to time to see how it going and as I assume others have/will do the same so you will have to devise a diversity factor to compare voters to those that chickened out.

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Thanks for voting.

Hi Bob,

You might consider a chemical safety survey as well. We use a lot of toxins as woodworkers. In talking to others the opinion often seems to be "Well, if it's sold at retail it must be safe." Given that many of the products we as woodworkers use contain acrylates, iso/thio cyanates, ketones (MEK), bisphenols, formalin/formaldehyde, urethane, epoxides, aromatics hydrocarbons, and so on it may be useful to discuss appropriate PPE that should be used as well as particular hazards unique to various classes of products. It seems that the pen turners are using lots of these things.

Cheers,
Rob

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Originally Posted by rob streeper

Hi Bob,

You might consider a chemical safety survey as well. We use a lot of toxins as woodworkers. In talking to others the opinion often seems to be "Well, if it's sold at retail it must be safe." Given that many of the products we as woodworkers use contain acrylates, iso/thio cyanates, ketones (MEK), bisphenols, formalin/formaldehyde, urethane, epoxides, aromatics hydrocarbons, and so on it may be useful to discuss appropriate PPE that should be used as well as particular hazards unique to various classes of products. It seems that the pen turners are using lots of these things.

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Good point.

Any awareness raising can be useful but I'll leave that to some else to have a crack at

Cheers

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Originally Posted by BobL

There is also the need for some place to air out oily rags rather than dumping them straight into a bin. Usually I hang these up outside so they are not all scrunched up and can get plenty of ai.

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This is what I am most paranoid about!

Thanks to all that responded to this poll.
I see we continue to do well on fire extinguishers (86%), cleanups (74%), but not so well on the remainder.
During my visits of sheds to perform dust measurements I did see mostly clean to very clean sheds - no doubt influenced by they fact that I'm coming around with a dust meter!! but I did not see anywhere near that level of fire extinguishers.
It would be interesting to see the shed that has the direct line to the fire brigade.

As I said in an earlier post, one issue with these polls is they tend to "preach to the converted", nevertheless I think it is worthwhile.

The poll is open indefinitely in case anyone else wants to add their responses.

I had my bro rewire my shed to get rid of the old fabric covered wires and to remove the chance of a dry joint and sawdust setting the place ablaze. Once a year vac the top of the 40ft Oregon beams to get rid of the dust buildup.
I also have a master switch that kills all power and use it when I vacate the premises at night.
There are 3 or 4 red pps that are live on the wall for the phone,clock and battery charging.
I am also careful re using extraction when sanding ferris stuff on the disc.
Bucket of water under the dripping tap and a bucket of sand near the welding/grinding area.
Wood and metal areas separate.
Paint cupboard external.
When I get to it mount a firehouse external and mark on the door where the oxy/acetylene etc is located inside for the firey's if they should ever need to visit when I'm not here.
H.

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Originally Posted by clear out

I had my bro rewire my shed to get rid of the old fabric covered wires and to remove the chance of a dry joint and sawdust setting the place ablaze. Once a year vac the top of the 40ft Oregon beams to get rid of the dust buildup.

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Not many people would think of that. :2tsup: OTOH if it's that bad perhaps you should also look at improving your dust extraction ?

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I also have a master switch that kills all power and use it when I vacate the premises at night.

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Good point. I tend to only do this if I am going away but I should get into the habit of doing this on a regular basis.

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I am also careful re using extraction when sanding ferris stuff on the disc.

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Fire from grinding can be a serious problem. Somewhere I read that around 80 people a year in the USA set their clothing on fire using angle grinders. Worse still is when these people are wearing synthetic clothing - very nasty indeed.

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Bucket of water under the dripping tap and a bucket of sand near the welding/grinding area.

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Excellent point although I hope it's not considered as a replacement for a fire extinguisher.
I think of a bucket of water as more of anti-burn first aid treatment. The sooner the burn is placed under cold running water the better but while the running water is being reached the next best thing is a bucket of water.
SWMBO put me onto this after I accidentally a picked up a piece of hot metal and gave myself a cm wide blister across 3 fingers and thumb on my left hand that hurt for days so bad that I could not use it. Next time this happened (Yes it did happen again :doh:) I stuck my hand immediately under cold running water and left it there for 20 minute and there was just a surface mark where my finger prints had melted, but there was no pain and no blisters.

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When I get to it mount a firehouse external and mark on the door where the oxy/acetylene etc is located inside for the firey's if they should ever need to visit when I'm not here.

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Very good. Even a notice saying that you have these inside a shed will help the fireys.

Found it:U

Is a mobile phone a direct line to the fire brigade?

Remember it is not enough to have the extinguishers they need regular inspection. You can do this yourself for the most part, check the gauge to see it it is still pressurised and in the green area, if a powder, turn it upside down and give it a shake.

I have three 1kg powder extinguishers and a blanket in my workshop.

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Originally Posted by Burnsy

Found it:U

Is a mobile phone a direct line to the fire brigade?

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The line I was thinking of was a heat sensor that directly rings the fire brigade. Like the ones we had in the Glass Blowing class at Uni. Some of the moronic students used to get bored after about 30 minutes and point their torch up towards a ceiling heat sensor and that would call the fire brigade out. Building would be evacuated lots of wasted time etc. After a half dozen times this happened the torches were mounted in such a way that they could not be pointed upwards.

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Remember it is not enough to have the extinguishers they need regular inspection. You can do this yourself for the most part, check the gauge to see it it is still pressurised and in the green area, if a powder, turn it upside down and give it a shake.

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Good point!

Hi Bob

an area not covered so far is ignition sources and control thereof

for example
rags used for finishing are stored in a sealed steel container or outside the shed

heat sources eg grinders and sparks from grinding are kept away from wood dust

ventilation -- to avoid the build up of an explosive atmosphere

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Originally Posted by ian

Hi Bob
an area not covered so far is ignition sources and control thereof

for example
rags used for finishing are stored in a sealed steel container or outside the shed

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Yep - quite important and this can go in the "Other" category

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Heat sources eg grinders and sparks from grinding are kept away from wood dust

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I was hoping this "Shed construction and fit out to suit activities (i.e. all metal bench for welding") would cover that aspect.

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ventilation -- to avoid the build up of an explosive atmosphere

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should be covered by "Adequate ventilation of flammable gasses"