Stacking split firewood against the house & termites - potential problem or fallacy?

G'day

I have a large tree (Mountain Ash) that I have completely reduced to split firewood. There were some rounds that had termites in them and after splitting they have been stored away from the timber house (although after the splitting they all seemed to think that somewhere else was a better place to be).

Conventional wisdom is that timber should not be stacked against the house, but I just wonder about that. I would have thought that termites would not be attracted to small pieces of timber because they like the dark. The biggest pieces are around 4x4" in cross section.

Furthermore, there are plenty of black ants around here, and they won't tolerate termites wandering around.

Any thoughts?

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Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

Conventional wisdom is that timber should not be stacked against the house, but I just wonder about that. I would have thought that termites would not be attracted to small pieces of timber because they like the dark. The biggest pieces are around 4x4" in cross section.

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Oh Lordy Lord. . . .Believe - Believe. In terms of darkness, termites are happy enough behind a layer of paint, well at least the ones that ate my bay window frame out were.

Termites can climb (build a tunnel) many feet between two sheets of fibre cement to get into some wood. I have also seen them eat their way up thru a 1m long 50 x 75 piece of pine to get into FIL shed where they completely ate out a pine wardrobe so 100 x 100 would make a nice freeway for them.

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Originally Posted by BobL

Oh Lordy Lord. . . .Believe - Believe. In terms of darkness, termites are happy enough behind a layer of paint, well at least the ones that ate my bay window frame out were.

Termites can climb (build a tunnel) many feet between two sheets of fibre cement to get into some wood. I have also seen them eat their way up thru a 1m long 50 x 75 piece of pine to get into FIL shed where they completely ate out a pine wardrobe so 100 x 100 would make a nice freeway for them.

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Better safe than sorry eh? My query is really in relation to termite free timber, and whether or not they would be attracted to the stack (and therefore the house). I guess what I'm thinking is that the house has always been there (and therefore available for lunch).

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Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

Better safe than sorry eh? My query is really in relation to termite free timber, and whether or not they would be attracted to the stack (and therefore the house). I guess what I'm thinking is that the house has always been there (and therefore available for lunch).

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It's all a bit of lottery really. One of my friends has a 40 year old house that is basically all jarrah and although there are termites all around his house they have not touched the house (yes they have sprayed but the spray eventually breaks down). A few years ago he made up some built in cupboards in he garage out of untreated pine and the blighters came up through a crack in the expansion joint in the concrete pad and started on the cupboard. We have a massive nest some 300 m long that runs down between the backs of blocks of houses on our inner city block. Attacks on houses have been random - we have been infested twice - once they attacked the 80 year old part of the house at the front and ate some of the jarrah veranda. The second time they hit our 1 year old extension at the back - came in under 3 m of brick paving to eat out a bay window made of pine and nyata which was touching the dirt by about half a brick thickness. They were up in teh ceiling timbers and had made a real mess. Fortunately the builder replaced everything and added a couple of courses of bricks to get the new frame up off the dirt.

Not too keen on lotteries, so I'll stack it away from the house (which is a pain because against the house it gets northern sun for drying it out - still green).

Thanks Bob (twere just a thought anyway)

Brett

There are many fallacies regarding termites. Most of these revolve around the fact that there is not a single species of termite, but many. Some like hardwood and some like softwood. There are just a few species of tree that they all eat (I think Victorian Ash is one of them but there may be others too).

In piles of timber lying on the ground I have seen termites climb over pine to get to hardwood and vice versa. Actually it's the results I saw as I didn't have the time, or the infra red goggles to stand about waiting :rolleyes: .

Ant caps don't stop termites, they just bring them out into the open where they build, as Bob said, overland tunnels. The purpose of ant caps is to make them do this so you stand a chance of spotting them.

All termites in your and my parts of the world require contact with the ground. Not so in FNQ and the NT where, there, species are quite happy up in the air so to speak.

The colony requires a queen. Their chances of survival once removed from her are negligible.

I have it in my mind that Mountain Ash is a particularly susceptible material, although that does need ratification, and I would be placing some distance between the house and my firewood pile.

I hope that helps a little.

Incidentally a purely subjective observation is that that they don't trouble with sawdust. I presume they are unable to guarantee tunnel integrity in such a loose medium. It would be interesting to pursue that line of thought as sawdust is a good insulation medium, but tends not to get much of a hearing because of the perceived termite risk.

Regards
Paul

Thanks Paul

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Originally Posted by Bushmiller

The colony requires a queen. Their chances of survival once removed from her are negligible. I never did find the bitch. :((

I have it in my mind that Mountain Ash is a particularly susceptible material, although that does need ratification, and I would be placing some distance between the house and my firewood pile. Yes, I'd agree as there were a few rounds that were infested (they were prolly all consecutive rounds from the same section of the tree).

Incidentally a purely subjective observation is that that they don't trouble with sawdust. Well that'd take all the fun out of it for them anyway:D

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What is the ground like under your potential stack? We definitely have them in the ground around us.
The footprint of the (brick) house is treated on a 5-yearly program but there is plenty of wood around the yard.

Plenty of various sizes of black ants too ... but that only helps in disposing of the bodies once I find an incursion. I am always trying to keep an eye out for the signs ... or where I might not be able to see the signs.

If you can plonk the wood down on top of a black ant colony, that'd be good. I don't know why the little buggers are so pleased to clean 'em out when I find 'em and kill 'em ... but can live a metre or two away from some until I do my boiled-water and swearing routine and serve them up to them.

They have come up from dirt. bricks and joins in concrete ... if you can use some scrap metal to start the pile up off from the ground that's a good idea (roadside pickup time can be very helpful). Keeping it as dry as possibly will also help - wet internal patches, say from rain, is a bad idea. And if it was near the house you would at least want to put a sheet-metal or good rubber barrier between the wood and your house ... I'm thinking colorbond sheets or those above-ground swimming pools that people throw away when they leak.

Air gaps as much as possible ... that thing that gets them started around here the most ... other than wood resting end-on into the ground ... is two pieces of wood resting against each other (horizontally or vertically). I got a lot of jarrah/hardwood, and they will fill in between where there is a small or touching gap ... often mostly barely digging into the hardwood. I don't have pine around here.

Except I lie. Recently i found that climbed up between some long rubbish wood I had vertically in front of the garage. Against that, stacked on top of each other were the Oregon pine legs from the bench I found and started rehabbing. I don't exactly need those pieces but my face hardened and I thought "bugger" when I saw that the tracks were behind those pieces. As it turned out ... they were untouched ... OK maybe a tenth of a millimetere ... :?

Surely pine is their "bread and butter" if you'll excuse the pun ... maybe it is something to do with the age of the wood??? Seemed very strange to me. They certainly don't wolf down hardwood around here ... but I have a crying on your shoulder story about some green 'english' oak that I got from the Forest Products Division auction not long before Derek was making his workbench. Out the front, resting against some big green jarrah boards ... walk past it several times a day. A few weeks later ... need to shift that out back before the other half has me decapitated ... Hang on a second!! :C

They ate about 8% of that stuff in no time - never seen anything like it here - happily nested up against the jarrah without touching it, other than to make the surface just slightly muddy :rolleyes:

In any case - whatever you decide - Vigilance is your watch-word :)

Cheers,
Paul

Had the same experience as BobL. I put a wooden jig under the lathe bench for safety. When I next came to use it all that remained was a paper thin shell. That was access to the shed via expansion joint. The jig was mountain ash.

I don't trust any of them!!!!!!!!!!!
We have been here (rural block, 4km from village) 32 years. It is granite sand with solid granite outcrops. I once cut some dead stringy up for fire wood. I left a few pieces on the ground because they wouldn't fit in the barrow. Came back some months later to cleanup and there were "raiding parties" under each block. I have pulled up fence posts that have been in the ground for a long time and found them in there. I just don't trust them of rely on spraying.
I store my firewood on the concrete verandah near the door closest to the fire. I stack between the verandah posts just in case I have bought home some in the fresh firewood. I purposely let the stack go down to zero (Its touch and go whether we have enough wood for those last few days of cold weather) because I don't like having a stockpile so close to the house.
Yeh I may be a bit paranoid. When we built the house I used Cypress Pine for everything. Bearers, joists,wall frames, flooring,roof timbers, battens even door jambs and architraves. I have even made furniture for the house with it. Did I say I don't trust them
If I were you I would stack clear of the house where you can see both sides of the stack to check if they have discovered the pile. You could tie on the top a piece of corrugated to keep rain off and the air could dry the wood for till you need it

Thanks Rod, Jim & Paul - some good observations there.

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Originally Posted by chambezio

I used Cypress Pine for everything. Bearers, joists,wall frames, flooring,roof timbers, battens even door jambs and architraves. I have even made furniture for the house with it. Did I say I don't trust them

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That's OK. You and I are both in the paranoia club. I do use ironbark for roof members (strength).

Imagine how disgruntled I was (was going to say P****d off, but not now I'm reformed) when my local cypress mill shut up shop. I use to travel less than 2 Km to the mill. Now I have to go 45Km to a neighbouring town, but on the positive side they have two mills right next door to each other :) .

Regards
Paul

Hi,
I thought stacking timber close to the house was a no no from the fire hazard point of view.
Regards

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not now I'm reformed

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Really.:rolleyes:

Mate of mine was experimental once and stupid twice!! :o:o

Don 't tempt fate it my friend!!!

:smack:ok

You live in the mountains & you are going to stack dry wood against the house!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:oHope your insurance company doesn't find out. Termites will be the least of your worries.

One thing that has been done in the past is to use H5 (ACC) treated timber as 'bait' by driving it into the ground where it is easy to get to for the termites - they have a nibble & either kill the nest or just don't like it & go else where. You could use a few scrap pieces as bearers for the bottom of the stack too.

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Originally Posted by bsrlee

You live in the mountains & you are going to stack dry wood against the house!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:oHope your insurance company doesn't find out. Termites will be the least of your worries.

One thing that has been done in the past is to use H5 (ACC) treated timber as 'bait' by driving it into the ground where it is easy to get to for the termites - they have a nibble & either kill the nest or just don't like it & go else where. You could use a few scrap pieces as bearers for the bottom of the stack too.

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:whs: