CoronaVirus ==> Empty Shelves

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Originally Posted by Greg Ward

Statistics.
.... Now from my understanding, 50% of the globe at Trump lovers, the other 50% are Trump haters....

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"...Since the early fifteenth century, for example, trump has served as a synonym for fart, or rather to denote an especially noisy fart. ..."

(A Dictionary of Culinary Curiosities) by Mark Morton

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Originally Posted by Greg Ward

Statistics.
This thread loves figures. Now from my understanding, 50% of the globe at Trump lovers, the other 50% are Trump haters.
Now, the few contributors to this thread all seem to be in the Hate camp, and there are no Lover responses, so I’m wondering why?
Is it:
a. Trump lovers feel so superior that they can’t be bothered to reply to the scribblings of deluded fools.
b. Trump lovers feel so inferior that they are fearful that anything they write will be treated with scorn and nasty responses from the superior intelligentsia.
c. Trump lovers can’t write.
d. Trump lovers can write but they spend so much time working hard on their businesses or making millions on the stock market that they haven’t got time to write.
e. Most forum members are so busy working on timber projects that they haven’t got any time to contribute to this post.
f. All of the above.

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Greg

There is a distinct anomaly in the American system where because there is no compulsory voting the successful candidate can win with the approval of only a quarter of the electorate. In fact Trump, you may recall, won despite Clinton attracting more votes, because of the College vote factor (another anomaly to my mind). In 2016 55.7% of the VAP (voting age population) voted ( Voter turnout in the United States presidential elections - Wikipedia ), but that includes quite a large percentage of ineligible voters too, so the actual percentage of eligible voters is smaller. To make the sums easier for my simple mind I have called it 50% and I don't think it would be far off.

From the States a Forum member has confirmed to me that Trump's popularity amongst his supporters has not noticeably waned. It could be that they continue to believe his rhetoric, despite the statistics, possibly because they want to believe. On the other hand, outside of the US his words and recent condemnation of the WHO are mainly seen as disgraceful and a blatant grab to delegate blame and attempt to maintain popularity. This is seen as particularly inappropriate at a time when so much of the world is suffering and the US is demonstrating bully tactics with medical supplies.

I suspect that there are mainly elements of "f" in your summary above. You could have added there is also the sentiment that the Americans are getting what they deserve: However, I would suggest that is a view that lacks compassion as no one except maybe the man at the top deserves to go through this pandemic, if it was avoidable.

Regards
Paul

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Originally Posted by BobL

According to my mum the person with the cleanest hands and nails in her family was her blacksmith father. Unfortunately I never met him but according to mum after work he would spend many minutes vigorously scrubbing his hands and nails with soap and water, and finish off by cutting a lemon in half and crushing it skin and all AND vigorously rub it all over his hands. The citric acid and lemon oil combo not only removed every trace of charcoal/rust and metal filings, but left his hands soft. All 8 of my uncles and aunts have remarked on how clean and soft his hands were. I've used the lemon wash a few times when I had spare lemons after handling cast iron and it does indeed work amazingly well at getting out the black stuff then ends up in finger/hand skin cracks.

In a workplace study a few years back metal workers were found to have some of the lowest hand bacterial counts of any profession because theY tended to wasH their hands far more often than anyone else. I wonder if the use of tight fitting gloves has made things worse rather than better. Amongst the worst for bacterial hand counts was anyone who used keyboards, especially if not always their own. Office door handles and cistern buttons of the toilets used by these workers were also higher in bacterial counts.

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Your Grandfather was also one tough man as well,
Straight lemon juice into any cuts on your hands is pure hell.
As one ex metal worker to another, I understand the ten minutes it’s takes to scrub your hands and arms clean at the end of the day.
An then the reminder of that cut you got at 10.45 am that you forgot about.

Paint thinners are also excellent cut finders!!

Cheers Matt,




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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Originally Posted by Greg Ward

Now from my understanding, 50% of the globe are Trump lovers, the other 50% are Trump haters.

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As Justonething points out those ratings only apply to the US. To be more precise, since the first 30 days of his presidency, he recently reached an all polls approval high of 45.8% when he started his daily press conferences on the virus. It has started to drop again as the press conferences have degenerated into the Donald show. He has the lowest ratings of ten presidents over the last ninety years. But, that could just be fake news.

Here are his ratings over his presidency, so far.

How Popular Is Donald Trump? | FiveThirtyEight

As for his international ratings...

How the world sees the U.S. and Trump in 10 charts | Pew Research Center

For me he is a symptom and not the cause of a deep malaise in the US. Donald is a worry, but even more troubling for me is that over 45% of its population still approves of his performance this far into his presidency.

In keeping with the forum rules, I attempt to avoid making comments of a political nature on local politics here in Australia. Having a bit of a grizzle is another matter.

However, I would think that offshore politics is different and that making fun of Donald is fair game. The US citizens may feel the need to respect their president, we don't. Although we don't get to vote on their president, their choices do have an impact on us, so we should at least have the right to express our derision if we see fit to do so. I don't see this as being any more political than ridiculing such leaders as "His Excellency, President for Life, Field Marshal Al Hadji Doctor Idi Amin Dada, VC, DSO, MC, Lord of All the Beasts of the Earth and Fishes of the Seas and Conqueror of the British Empire (CBE) in Africa in General and Uganda in Particular", and last King of Scotland!
But, as always, I respect the decisions of the moderators.

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Originally Posted by Greg Ward

Statistics.
e. Most forum members are so busy working on timber projects that they haven’t got any time to contribute to this post.

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g. Finding new clients to replace the ones that have begun hibernating.


Yes! I picked up a new actual-real-paying-client on Wednesday. I can eat again! Huzzah!

.... at least for this and next week :(

:2tsup:

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Originally Posted by Greg Ward

Statistics.
This thread loves figures. Now from my understanding, 50% of the globe at Trump lovers, the other 50% are Trump haters.
Now, the few contributors to this thread all seem to be in the Hate camp, and there are no Lover responses, so I’m wondering why?

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I'm not in the hate camp. If I was a yank, i'd vote for Trump. He seems to have been doing a pretty good job before corona. Pretty good doesn't mean great, nor bad, he's just a politician but at least he doesn't cower to the left leaning muppets of the press. So he gets a thumbs up from me on that point alone. I'm no fool, he has royally screwed up with corona and now is playing a blame game with WHO and China. If he gets re-elected, I fear he will take that as a mandate to continue to shoot his mouth off at China which will possibly end up being a prelude to war. War between China and USA.....god help us all!

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Originally Posted by Kuffy

.... he's just a politician but at least he doesn't cower to the left leaning muppets of the press. ...

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WOW; you are the first person I have heard describe Rupert and his scribes as "left leaning muppets".

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Originally Posted by woodPixel

g. Finding new clients to replace the ones that have begun hibernating.


Yes! I picked up a new actual-real-paying-client on Wednesday. I can eat again! Huzzah!

.... at least for this and next week :(

:2tsup:

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Good onya!

Be like LEGO people,people

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...1ffaa3b44b.jpg

Cheers Matt.

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Originally Posted by GraemeCook

WOW; you are the first person I have heard describe Rupert and his scribes as "left leaning muppets".

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I realise that Rupert controls much of the Australian news media, but I was thinking more along the lines of American news such as NBC, CNN or ABC.

Looking again this morning at the modelling for the USA that I have been regularly following, they are still tracking close to the projection of about 70k deaths by 4 August, provided they retain full social distancing to the end of May.

The projection for today (17 April) was about 32K total deaths and Woldometer is reporting about 34.5k. The number bounce around a bit, but at this rate they may do better than Spain and Italy per capita, but the projections for those (see pull down country options) are nearing their peak whereas the USA has a long way to go yet and there is still a lot of upside uncertainty built into the US projections.

Remove the social distancing that is built into the modelling for each of the countries/locations before the end of May and that will produce very different projected outcomes.

See third chart here.

There is a lot of very rich data in the modelling, like the projected peak and ICU bed shortages at peak demand. No wonder Spain, Italy, the UK and New York have struggled as can be clearly seen by pulling down the charts for each of those places.

Note: Many countries, large and small, are included in the modelling, but not Australia. Why am I'm not surprised!

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Originally Posted by Kuffy

I realise that Rupert controls much of the Australian news media, but I was thinking more along the lines of American news such as NBC, CNN or ABC.

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???

Wall Street Journal
Dow Jones
Fox News
Fox Business

The (London) Times
Sunday Times
Financial Times
The Sun

Are you listing centre right publications in an attempt to sway my view that Trump doesn't cower to "left" leaning muppets of the press? You quoted what I said, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you actually read what I said.

according to this source Why B.C.'''s top doctor still believes mass testing isn'''t the way to stop COVID-19 | CBC News the Covid-19 "test" can deliver a false negative result 30% of the time. Just to clarify 30% of patients testing negative to the virus are actually positive to the virus. At that rate of false negatives I think it's more than appropriate that I describe the Covid-19 test as "test".

What is scary, at least for me, is that according to a radio interview with a Canadian virologist on CBC this afternoon (Thursday April 16) the rate of false negatives INCREASES from 10% to 30% as the duration of the infection increases.

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Originally Posted by NeilS

As for farts and Covid-19 transmission, according to Norman Swan on the radio this morning, no bare arsed ones within physical distancing guidelines. Done wearing the usual masking apparel on the rear end, no problem!

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Good to see, then, that my old mum in the UK is taking the appropriate precautions:

Attachment 471892

Remember when we were crowing about ticking over post #1,000?

Remember when we were predicting 100,000 deaths in Australia

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Originally Posted by Greg Ward

Remember when we were predicting 100,000 deaths in Australia

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Hahaha! I'm glad you said that because I never could have, I would have been shouted down...

Coronavirus live news: Wuhan death toll revised up 50% as China's economy suffers worst fall on record | World news | The Guardian

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Originally Posted by Greg Ward

Remember when we were predicting 100,000 deaths in Australia

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Actually I don't, but there were all sorts of numbers swirling around before any (or many) preventative steps were taken. When was that?

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Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

Actually I don't, but there were all sorts of numbers swirling around before any (or many) preventative steps were taken. When was that?

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I think you've missed the point again mate... :)

As a retired burgler I can assure you that plenty of men don’t wash their hands after going to the toilet, number 2’s included

Is it true that in SA they've introduced new random breath testing? But for Covid19, not booze? Is it also true that all the new booze busses include an ICU?

I'm curious...how does a burglar know that? (not that I'm doubting what you say...)

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Originally Posted by Slave

As a retired burgler I can assure you that plenty of men don’t wash their hands after going to the toilet, number 2’s included

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That should be burgler

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Originally Posted by Slave

That should be burgler

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American dictionary spell checker...

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Originally Posted by Greg Ward

Remember when we were predicting 100,000 deaths in Australia

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Nobody on this thread was predicting that without giving the qualification.... "unless significant steps are taken."

https://www.woodworkforums.com/f43/c.../5#post2177629

But, thankfully Australia did take the necessary steps to avoid that worst case scenario against a push back from some quarters (well much less than that) of the media.

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Originally Posted by NeilS

Nobody on this thread was predicting that without giving the qualification.... "unless significant steps are taken."

https://www.woodworkforums.com/f43/c.../5#post2177629

But, thankfully Australia did take the necessary steps to avoid that worst case scenario against a push back from some quarters (well much less than that) of the media.

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There are a whole lot of factors that allowed us to escape this. We've been lucky. Don't give all the credit to "significant steps"

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Originally Posted by NeilS

But, thankfully Australia did take the necessary steps to avoid that worst case scenario against a push back from some quarters (well much less than that) of the media.

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As well as from some on this forum.

Prof Paul Kelly (Dep CMO) is not ruling out making downloading their tracking app compulsory. "I think we'll start with it being voluntary and see how it goes." he said in response to a journalist asking him if it could become compulsory. PPK is no doubt only acting from a public health point of view, and may not be seeing the potentially sinister side of the idea.

My partner has lived through the various Police State/Military Juntas of Argentina in the 70s and 80s, and understandably she is not at all happy about it.

Some questions that I can think of:

• What guarantee do we have that the data will not be used for anything else? Certainly mobile phone movements can currently be traced, but that requires a warrant or court order AFAIK.
• What guarantee do we have that this is not the thin end of the surveillance wedge, and that the surveilling will not continue after the pandemic crisis is finished because Mr Potato Head can now track us all?
• What guarantee do we have that this golden opportunity to turn it into an Australia Card on steroids will not be taken?
• Do they really need that data, given that Australia is more or less leading the western world in controlling the virus?

I will wait to see what answers we can get to those or similar questions before I decide one way or another, but atm I am very sceptical of trusting a Govt of any flavour with that sort of data.

How do you all feel about the Govt knowing where you are at any given time?

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Originally Posted by ian

What is scary, at least for me, is that according to a radio interview with a Canadian virologist on CBC this afternoon (Thursday April 16) the rate of false negatives INCREASES from 10% to 30% as the duration of the infection increases.

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Ian

That makes me wonder if it is a result of mutation. Around the world the virus is not exactly the same because of at least three mutations, but I don't know the details ( or exact numbers of mutations ) and I don't know how the tests are conducted and the criteria that is examined.

Regards
Paul

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Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

Prof Paul Kelly (Dep CMO) is not ruling out making downloading their tracking app compulsory. "I think we'll start with it being voluntary and see how it goes." he said in response to a journalist asking him if it could become compulsory. PPK is no doubt only acting from a public health point of view, and may not be seeing the potentially sinister side of the idea.

My partner has lived through the various Police State/Military Juntas of Argentina in the 70s and 80s, and understandably she is not at all happy about it.

Some questions that I can think of:

• What guarantee do we have that the data will not be used for anything else? Certainly mobile phone movements can currently be traced, but that requires a warrant or court order AFAIK.
• What guarantee do we have that this is not the thin end of the surveillance wedge, and that the surveilling will not continue after the pandemic crisis is finished because Mr Potato Head can now track us all?
• What guarantee do we have that this golden opportunity to turn it into an Australia Card on steroids will not be taken?
• Do they really need that data, given that Australia is more or less leading the western world in controlling the virus?

I will wait to see what answers we can get to those or similar questions before I decide one way or another, but atm I am very sceptical of trusting a Govt of any flavour with that sort of data.

How do you all feel about the Govt knowing where you are at any given time?

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At last, a glint of gold in the bottom of the pan... from FenceFurniture! Who would have guessed? Keep it up mate!

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Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

How do you all feel about the Govt knowing where you are at any given time?

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Under normal circumstances, no way!

Data security, proscribed uses and a legislated sunset clause would be prerequisites before I would be prepared to consider giving my location in return for a well justified benefit for myself and others.

The right to exit and for all data to be deleted would also be a consideration.

And, the responsible minister would be another factor in my decision making.

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Originally Posted by NeilS

Under normal circumstances, no way!

Data security, proscribed uses and a legislated sunset clause would be prerequisites before I would be prepared to consider giving my location in return for a well justified benefit for myself and others.

The right to exit and for all data to be deleted would also be a consideration.

And, the responsible minister would be another factor in my decision making.

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But if you're not doing anything criminal why would you be concerned...?

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Originally Posted by Tccp123

But if you're not doing anything criminal why would you be concerned...?

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...playing the devil's advocate obviously (just in case it wasn't obvious) :)

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Originally Posted by Tccp123

But if you're not doing anything criminal why would you be concerned...?

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So far not a concern in over seventy years, but then who knows what changes in the law might turn me into one...:cool:

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Originally Posted by NeilS

So far not a concern in over seventy years, but then who knows what changes in the law might turn me into one.

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Good answer

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Originally Posted by Tccp123

...playing the devil's advocate obviously (just in case it wasn't obvious) :)

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"Show me the man and I’ll show you the crime" - Lavrentiy Beria

Must be careful here. I remember Howard well. At the end, well.... there you go.

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Originally Posted by NeilS

On the other 'hand', holding the siphon python is another matter. That depends on where it and your hand has been!

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Well it's your d!ck and its your soap and you can wash it as fast as you like.

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Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

How do you all feel about the Govt knowing where you are at any given time?

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On the surface, it seems like a good idea. I personally don't care if the government know where I am though I am technically against it without having any great reason except for 'there is always some greedy bugger with access to power and he is dumb enough to use it for his own personal gain, often at the cost of the great many".

from Virus mobile tracking app may be mandatory | The Canberra Times | Canberra, ACT

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It uses Bluetooth to plot people who had spent 15 minutes or more in close proximity to a person with coronavirus.

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Today, I have been at work, been to Maccas, KFC (in the shopping center) and the fush n chup shop (at a different shopping center). The app will have registered me working alongside the workmates, but not maccas, kfc or fush n chups because I was in and out quick as a flash each time. I would remember if I was at work for any standard business day, but I wouldn't need to remember because the business will be shut down for 14 days as soon as I get confirmed infected anyway.

so for the most part, the tracking app gains the government SFA with me, because I would be able to tell them I was at work.

however, also from the same above linked article.

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Better contact tracing is one of three main benchmarks the government wants to meet before strict restrictions can be lifted.

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If I wanted to hang out with mates for an extended period during the day (we can't at the moment), the government will want better tracking/tracing capacity. Which effectively means we have a choice. Go outside and be tracked, or stay in lock down until a vaccine is produced or suitable treatment is discovered. The government wants the economy back up and running, as I'm sure we all do, so do we really have a choice at all? I think not. But it is nice that they pretended to ask.