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Yeah can't wait. It used to keep me awake at nights but now I do not worry about it - I am too preoccupied with a door jamb that is out of alignment and the damn bath hob.
I was going to build the hob out of hebel but after seeing the price of it I think I will use a pine frame and villaboard cladding.
Hmm Juan almost 2 weeks and no update (have you been slacking LOL) ! We are into the frantic season - the lead up to xmas - tradies cant find time, stock sold out - showerscreens can't get installed - argh the joy! Hope same thing doesnt happen on your bathroom.
Doog
Hi Doog,
Have decided to leave it as an unfinished project. HA HA
No, I have been working every hour god gave on the damn Federal Election and have had no time for the beast since 5/11. Will get back to the sucker next week.
Have started building the bath hob out of Hebel.
Attachment 60803
Cheers
How are you going to bed the bath in now that you've enclosed all four sides. :?
Working on the election ?????? I must use that one sometime LOL. I'm intrigued now.
The 2 hebel blocks on the bottom right front are just levelled and supported on thin bed of sand and are easily removable. Once I finish putting all the other blocks in position with hebel adhesive and finishing the top 'cutout' it will be all solid and I will pull out those 2 blocks which are next to the waste pipe. I am thinking I may tile the walls behind and around the bath as well as the hebel top of the hob before plumber and I drop in the bath and connect with a flexidinger. Once the bath is in and set in mud then I will apply adhesive to the 2 blocks and set them back in position to close the hole so I can tile the front of the hob.
Does this sound like the way to go? I am learning to fly this sucker as I go.
I havent installed an island bath - but I was under the impression that you had to put mortar under them when you set them for support. Some baths are self levelling / self supporting with plastic rubber bastings on the base.
I have no affilliation to any candidate.
Yes, I will put a couple of buckets of mortar under the bath before setting it in and connecting the flexidinger. Probably 1/3 fill it with water to keep it weighed down against the tiled top. Once satisfied all is ok then can close the opening at the front.
Your plan sounds very feasible then and shouldn't cause any drama.
Hope you've ordered the shower screen if you want to finish for Xmas - I got caught today - cut off for pre xmas installation was yesterday GRRR!
I have almost finished the hob ready to tile the top. Think I will do the hob in the crappy chocolate tiles the women chose for the floor. I will waterproof the hob top and surrounding wall, then tile just the top before dropping in the bath.
Will not be able to look at it until end of next week unfortunately as am flat out working at moment.
No rush as the young one is heading off on holiday for 6 weeks and we have the en-suite.
At least if fits very snuggly in the cut out hebel top and I am surprised how solid it seems even before bedding in mortar. Really strong rim on the bath to support and add stability.
Attachment 61305
cheers
Hi Juan,
Read your bathroom reno psts with interest. How does your bathroom look like now... any new pics???
May I ask what you did about waterproofing the bathroom floor and walls.
Thanks in Advance
I have just got back onto the beast today and went and bought some tiles and waterproofing kit. Been working flat out and not had time to look at it.
Primed the walls and the hebel hob with an acrylic primer. Applied silicon to the wall joints and hebel hob to wall joints. Will water proof the hob, shower walls (down to about 150mm above the floor) and around where the vanity unit will mount tomorrow with 2 coats of DriBond Liquid Flash.
I have yet to screed the floor so will complete waterproofing the bottom of the shower wall and floor after the floor is screeded. My current plan is to tile the walls and the bath hob first(leaving the bottom row of tiles off of course) then screed the floor and tile it.
Hi Sugam
Here is a photo just taken. I have just got back on the job again.
Attachment 62643
I am not a tiler and what I know about waterproofing is dangerous.
As mentioned earlier, I have primed all the walls to be tiled and the bath hob top and side. That sealed the Hebel block hob quite nicely. I then applied a 1.2mm thick coat of DriBond Liquid Flash and while still liquid I embedded in it 200mm wide bond breaker tape allong the wall to hob joins. After a couple of hours I gave it another liberal coat of Liquid Flash waterproof membrane to completely cover the tape and ensure all the top surface of the hob is well waterproofed. I went up the wall 150mm with the waterproofing.
I will start tiling the top of the hob as soon as the waterproofing membrane cures (about 3 days I think). We are tiling the hob with the floor tiles. I can then put in the lower run of tiles on the end wall.
Am tossing up wether to take of the architrave around the window and router it a bit so the tiles cuts can hide under it. I have a little 75mm frieze to install on top of the existing tile height and then one full tile on top of that. Do not blame me for the colour scheme there are women involved in the decision making around here.
I bought a little tile saw from Bunnies for $86 and it seems to be the bees knees provided the diamond blade lasts. Gee I love tiling.
Attachment 62728
Only did about 2 hours today so only laid about 20 tiles. Gee it's fun.
Have been mixing small quantities (1kg) of adhesive by hand and it has small lumps in it which are a bugger to get rid of completely until I trowel the adhesive on the wall. Might try the mixmaster tomorrow.
LOL Juan ! I would tend to do the router job on the window trims. That way you are left with the impression that the trim goes over the tiles and makes for a hidden tile edge.
Grouting is lots of fun too LOL.
Re Glue mixing - go and buy a paddle mixer attachment for an electric drill - they cost about $12 - it makes it so easy to mix tile glue and grout. You'll need at least a 550 watt drill though.
I mixed two 1kg batches today using the old kitchen mixer. Brilliant job - just like cake mix - smooth as a babies bottom.
Well 5 hours on day 3 of the tiling and starting to see a dent in the wall tiling part.
Took Doogies advice and removed the architraves on the window and cut the tiles to go underneath. Just hope I can router it ok. Have an old router but have not used it for 20 years.
Unfortunately Beaumont Tiles is out temorarily of stock on the mosaics the women picked for the horizontal frieze so will be waiting probably until mid Jan to finish the walls at the earliest.
Fitted the heated towel rail just to see it would mount ok (it will eventually be on the door hinge side as I have to fit a new door and hang it from the other side). Drilled the tiles before putting them up. Cut holes for the underfloor heater controller and the power point for the towel rail.
The other side will be more complicated to tile with the WC, vanity, bath and shower mixers, hot and cold outlers, power, lights and temperature controller for the HWS. Also think I have stuffed up slightly with the height of the cold water outler for the WC so may have to cut the line and adjust the height(plumber will love me). Left the pipe exposed of render as anticipated it was not going to be right height. Damn hidden plumbing in close coupled suite is more trouble than it is worth.
Plan to mount a vertical vanity fluoro light fitting on either side of the vanity mirror so will just put 2 wall boxes in the render before tiling it to hold the fitting and terminate the cable. Then if I change my mind I can just tile over them and put a single fluoro above the mirror. Have already run the cables.
I may tile the top of the hob with the floor tiles before tiling the other 2 walls. After much deliberation and opinion collection I have decided not to bevel the tiles on the front edge of the hob nor to use a metal or plastic edge trim. I will sort through the tiles and find 10 tiles with the most overspray on the sides and just butt them up. The trims stand out like dogs appendages and every display I have seen with the bevel cut tiles looks like rougher than just butting them up.
Attachment 62947
Cheers
Well I have finally got back on the project again. Removed the door, removed all the 15 or so layers of paint with my metabo heat gun and some paint stripper. Surprised how easy it was. I filled the old hinge holes and latch holes in door and jamb with Fuller Building Filler (2 pack). It was 42degrees and it went off in about 1minute flat. Luckily I mixed only very small quantities and did one hole at a time. Great stuff to work with. I sanded the door lightly after filling the small dents and screw holes then painted the door with water based primer.
I then rehung the door on the opposite side or the jamb. It was quite a pain because the door jamb is about 6mm out of plumb and the top of the door jamb is about 8mm out of level in 820mm. The door had been cut previously to fit the dodgy opening. I had to do the same trick but it worked out fine. I set the bottom hinge in by 3mm and the top one out by 3mm to allow the door to line up nicely at the latch side. Once the architrave is on it will never be noticeable. Gave the outside of the bathroom door a light coat of some left over horrible pink paint just to disguise it a bit until we redecorate the whole house.
Attachment 63751
Attachment 63748
I have tiled quite a bit of the wall . As shown in the photos, I have allowed for 2 x double GPOs (one on each side of the vanity unit), Wall mounted switching for the fan, and heat lamps. I have also prepared the mounting and wiring for the Rinnai 26 Plus remote temperature controller. There is wiring for 2 vertical fluoro lights to go on either side of the mirror. I collected the rest of the mosaic glass tiles for the frieze today so now hope to finish all the wall tiling tomorrow (bar the bottom run of tiles)
My plan is then to tile the bath hob top and fit the bath. I have been promising to do thehob for a month. Anyway slowly getting there.
Attachment 63749
Attachment 63750
Hey Juan, it is beginning to look good in there. I'm just wondering how you went with the tile edges on top of the hob - another trick to finish the edge is to use supafine grout to make a corner bead.
Hi Doog,
Have still not done the hob tiling but have decided dead set that I will just butt the tiles and not bevel them or use edge strip. Cannot decide where to start the floor tiling. I had thought of using the centre line of the bathroom floor(and hob) as a start point. but that will mean a bit of odd cutting around the door jamb where the tiles will be most noticeable. It would make tiling the hob (i am going to use floor tiles on it) easier if I centred them and I would get almost a full tile on either side of the room. If I try to use the centre of the door as the start line them I get some odd sizes at the shower set down and near the walls.
I have put the decision on hold until I finish the walls so as not to overload my brain. I can wait until after I screed the floor to make the decision anyway.
Got sidetracked today and did not do much tiling but getting there slowly.
Attachment 63881
Attachment 63882
It is looking really good. Thanks Jaun for taking the time to keep us posted. The problems and comments by the forum members has been most interesting and instructive. Thanks again - great thread.
Thanks Pusser.
The help I have received on this forum has been invaluable to me and if the discussions on various problems I have along the way helps others then the thread will be justified.
I have learned that no matter how well you think you have planned, bathroom renovations are a real worry. My estimate of time to complete the job given the scope of the work was totally unrealistic. My budget surprisingly is better than expected to date(touch wood) - as I had made allowances for anticipated issues on tasks already performed that fortunately I managed to solve cheaply. For example I had allowed $400 for a new door and possible replacement of the door jamb which was knocked about and out of plumb. I managed to clean up the door ok and rehang it on the other side for the cost of 2 hinges, some paint stripper, sand paper and primer (total $45). No doubt something will come out of left field and skittle me if I ever get into the home straight as that is Murphy's Law but in the mean time I shall keep plodding along.
Some of the problems that are worrying me and yet to be solved are:
1 Floor tiling layout to fit in with the bath hob if I am to keep the joins aligned. Perhaps I should not worry about lining up the joins on the hob and floor?
2 Finding a wall hung vanity unit which is 1200mm wide, reasonable narrow depth (do not want it fouling the shower angle door), china top possible with a jutting bowl, non-white preferable wood grain look veneer cabinet ( need some more colour to avoid hospital look)
3 Deciding on lighting. I have the IXL tastic installed just outside the proposed shower door and have allowed for 2 vertical flouros on either side of the mirror above vanity. Need to either put in a chandelier type fitting above bath or maybe a couple of downlights. Have not pursued this area yet and had thought of a couple of CFL downlights above bath and in front of vanity in the centre line of the room?
4 Screeding the floor. This one is a real worry.
5 Underfloor heating to install in the screed.
6 Getting a frameless shower screen at a reasonable price that looks classy and is good quality without blowing the budget.
HI Juan,
Its those little decisions like lights, shower screens, where tiles line up, getting the right vanity that usually drive me crazy - oh and things like matching taps, towel rails, color of grout. In fact pretty much everything about getting a good looking bathroom is annoying LOL.
As for floor tiling - keep your full tiles for just inside the door, cut tiles at the room entrance looks crappy IMO.
Unless your floor tiles are the same size as your wall tiles - the wall and floor groutlines arent ever going to line up properly. In your situation I think I would tend to put the cut floor tiles under the vanity wall where they would hardly be noticed. Are you still doing diagonal tiles??
Have you considered the idea of a full tile (300 x 300 or something like that) border with the remainder infill done as smaller mosiac type tiles? Mosiacs are much easier to get fall with.
The vanity will needs lots of shopping around but I have seen some 1200 long in a dark timber finish (Can't remember if it was real timber though). I never plan a bathroom until I know what is available these days.
The frameless shower screen as depicted in your original plan - I'd be surprised if you get out of that purchase for under $2000. Fully frameless uses 10 mm glass and wall brackets and hinged door - it looks very classy. There will also be a bit of chrome bar over the door for stability.
However after much shopping around I have discovered that Stegbar make a SEMI FRAMELESS screen in 6mm glass (which come in around 50% of the price of fully frameless 10 mm) These screens have a metal channel running down the walls and across the top. It still has hinged doors and clear glass edges around the door.
The reason I mention Stegbar is that they are (as far as I know) the only mob to use a low profile metal channel that isnt chunky or obtrusive like a lot of the aluminium channel a lot of places try and sell for a 6mm semiframeless. It might be worth going into a stegbar show room and having a look.
Chandeliers ?? HMM dunno about that LOL. I think some downlight type would give a nicer light
Screeding - sorry your on your own heh heh!
Doog
Hi Doog,
I have already bought the floor tiles which are 200mm square. I will be using them on the hob as well. Have dispensed with the idea of tiling on the diagonal mainly due to the tiling on the hob will be on the square. Beaumonts suggested use 3mm gap on the hob same as the floor and line up the joins. If I thought it would look ok I would centre the tiles on the hob with 1.5mm joins and then offset the joins on the floor to suit the door opening and the wall and use the 3mm joins. Yes I agree not much will be seen under the WC and the Vanity and that is the place for the odd cuts. I intend to start the tiles from the brass angle to be placed across the door but think it would look better if the tiles were centred on the door opening so that the cut tiles around the jambs are the same on both sides of the opening. I have to consider the set down for the shower as well so that I do not get a small slice of tile at the brass angle or that may look odd as well. So many damn decisions on tiling. I delay every decision I can to prevent my brain overloading but getting very near to having to make a decision as walls will be finished as far as I can go soon.
I will look at the Stegbar screens but I know they like to have the all tiling finished nice and level before they measure up so that decision has been given a lower priority. Same with the lighting I can delay decision on that for a while but agree the downlights seem better idea but thought I would wait until all the bits and pieces are in then decide the lighting.
I am waiting on Seima to reopen after the break in Adelaide as I know they have some interesting 1200mm vanity tops in vitreous china. Maybe if I could get one at a reasonable price I would build or get built a wall hung cabinet in the style and colour I want. Again the plumbing will accept any unit and there is no rush on that decision either.
I have started laying out the tiles for the floor and hob to see how I can do it the with the least pain.
Attachment 64154Attachment 64155
My plan is to start the full tile at the 50mm x 50mm brass angle which I wll set in the screed across the door opening and half way under the door. I can neatly fit 4 tiles in between the door jambs. As it works out I will then get a full tile all the way down the long side of the room on the door side. The room turns out to be perfectly square on that side (have not checked the other side but it looks like it will be good also. The negative is that when I reach the hob I will have a tile cut 60mm long at the hob wall. Does this sound ok or should I centre the tiles and have a 130mm cut tile at the door and the hob??
I think I will line up the joins on the hob and the floor meaning 3mm gaps on the hob and a cut tile about 140mm wide on the hob on the dunny side of the room and a full tile on the door side. I do not think this diffence will be too noticeable as I am sure the women will load up the hob top ends with shampoo and the like. The front face of the hob on the toilet side will be hidden in the large part by the toilet.
I think tomorrow I may tile the top of the hob and the top row of the hob front. It would then be possible to finish the wall tiling around the hob and install the bath prior to screeding the floor. As stated previously I think I can get away with just butting the tiles on the leading edge of the hob rather than bevelling them or using edging strip.
Any comments on the proposed layout would be appreciated.
Cheers
Geez you are lucky Juan LOL.
Sometimes you just have to have a cut tile somewhere and I dont think that the cut down the far end looks too bad. A mid to dark shade of grout and you won't notice any cuts.
Hmm I dont know about the dark tile color though but anyway ....
Just a quick point about your toilet - Is it one of the type that can be concreted down or bedded down?? Depending on the slope of your scree you will probably find that the front edge and or side of the pan needs to be packed up.
Generally it looks better if the pan has a minimum of silicone around it and I like to lay out my tiles and mark where the tiles under the pan are going to be and level the scree across these tiles.
Looking good so far
Doog
Hi Doog,
I agree the floor tile colour is a little darker than I originally had in mind but the women chose. They first chose a plain chocolate brown tile which was much darker and would have shown every water mark. Luckily they compromised on a lighter shade with a mottled pattern which should be better in hiding water marks and be less severe overall on the eyes. It is a very bright bathroom having an east facing window and I think it will be ok.
The toilet system is a Coroma Opal close coupled suite that will be bedded in mortar or whatever. I will take your advice and markout exactly where it will go and level the screed under those tiles. I was lucky with the water inlet for the toilet as it is exactly in the right place. I had thought it was too low until I did some level checking.
Have sorted and mixed all the boxes of floor tiles as per instruction and selected about 20 tiles with heaps of overspray on one side that I can use for the hob top leading edge. I will have a box plus of floor tiles left over so worst case senario is I redo the front edge and fit an edge strip one day it they look to crappy or get damaged.
I did a layout of the shower screen and vanity area and will comfortably get away with a 500mm deep vanity unit cabinet which is a relief as I can now chose the wall hung unit I like rather than a narrow cabinet semi recessed one which are a bit like rocking horse manure.
Well I suppose I should go and tile the top of the hob as it will not do itself.
Cheers
Well 2 hours to fix about 16 tiles, I would never make living as a tiler. What a pain to line up the tiles on the top and face of the hob so as to get a possible acceptable external corner on the front of the hob. Hopefully it will get easier from here.
Attachment 64268
Yeh it can sure take time - imagine if you didn"t have another bathroom lol
Well I have got my levels calculated for the screed. I drilled a few holes in the slab, plugged them and used plasterboard screws as guides when I am screeding and to fine tune the levels (I hope). I can pull them out as I go or leave them there for that matter.
Have laid out my heating cables roughly and run the system for a few minutes to check it is working. Will tidy it up a bit tomorrow.
Attachment 65017
Looks ok so far. Got the whole kit for around $177(including shipping and insurance) from this guy on eBay http://www.vodoley91.com/?nav=products
Great to deal with no matter how many stupid questions you ask he always get back to you asap.
Maybe on the weekend I might mix up some mud and screed it. Everyone bar one keeps telling me plastering sand is ok for the screed. I will make a few more enquiries on that one tomorrow.
plastering sand ? I've always used clean washed river sand for screes and ramping. plastering sand is really fine but should do the trick also.
I took much advice on what sand to use and 9/10 said plastering sand or concrete sand were both ok. Technical rep for Brighton Cement said they do not recommend plastering sand as it has a little to much clay in it and may crack . He recommended concrete sand. Thats what I used. Purchased .25 ton of the stuff and 4 bags of Brighton cement and it worked out perfect almost for about 5.5m2 of floor area at about 35mm ave depth.
Also purchased a litre of Kemcrete which I used to prime the floor before screeding and added to the water in the screed mix as a bonding agent.
Attachment 65068
Mixed the screed as dry as was possible to work it and found the guide screws in the floor for the levels were fantastic. Have left them there and they will hold the screed to the slab (ha ha) if my work is shoddy.
Tomorrow I should be able to give her a final rub down with a brick to knock of any high spots but I think it is ok as it is. Will chuck a sheet of plastic over it tomorrow but for now it is trying to rain and humidity is high so should not dry out to quick.
Actually the task was very straight forward and went well - I had been worried for some time about doing this myself. I will leave it for a few days then tile it.
Attachment 65069
Sounds like it went petty straight forward. What sort of sand is "concrete sand" ?
In the pic the scree surface looks very wet - was water coming to the surface? This can cause problems with the additive.
I think it is washed river sand. I spoke to 5 sand and metal suppliers and they all said this is what they supply the tilers for screeding.
Mixed it in 4 small batches and a little moisture came to the surface in one batch as I had to work it quite a bit to get the levels. Moisture dissappeared very quickly. Photo was taken 5 mins after last batch was laid. I think the primer acts as a sealer as well and holds the moisture in the screed longer.
Hope she will be ok.
The floor tiling is moving slowly towards that spot where the close coupled toilet suite (Caroma Opal) will reside.
What is the recommended method of tiling and installing the WC. Should I just tile the whole floor and forget the dunny for now or should I leave a couple of tiles off under the toilet to let her grip the floor and be more stable? Tiles are a bit smooth and was worried that the bog under the pan may not hold too well??
Any advice welcome
cheers
Does the pan have any holes for screw down fixing ?? it is usually the screws that hold pans down - and a mortar bedding in the top line jobs.
Generally you layout and space the tiles, numbering them with a nikko or paint pen - position the toilet exactly and mark on the tiles the outer edge of the pan and also push the pen into the screw holes - anything so you get a mark where the screws go through.
Then if you have a grout in only pan (rare) or wish to use grout as well as screws -
lift the pan away and make a paper template of the base wall thicknesses and mortar voids. Cut the template out and position on marked floor tiles - then mark the void spaces onto the tiles.
You now have the option of either
1) fixing pan first and cutting tiles around it (hard option if you dont know how to grind away tiles) ..
or 2) fix tiles down after pre drilling an oversize hole for screws (make sure you measure the angle that the screws are set and drill a hole in tile wide enough) and chipping away tile for waste pipe. If you are going to mortar down as well - or only - you cut out the sections of tiles where the pan voids are located and fix tiles.
Simple huh?
Do you remember I suggested you set the tiles under the pan level ? or maybe 2 mm max fall? You'll find out why quite soon LOL.
Tip : if you are screwing down pan do not put drill bit into hole in pan to drill. make position on scree and drill without tile in position. Screwing down will puncture your waterproofing membrane. When fixing pan down - fill pilot hole with polyurethane sealnt - push in plastic expanding masonry grip - spread extruded polyurethane across base of hole in tile - then fix pan down.
Thanks Doog,
I have taken care to get the floor level where the pan will sit so that should not be an issue.
Found the technical sheet on the unit and it appears to indicate there are 2 fixing options -
1. Bedding in 3:1 sand cement mix to a depth of 60mm OR
2. Screw fixing using a Caroma Screw fixing kit and acetic cured silicone sealant
I will get the plumber back to fit the toilet and connect the water and waste outlet. Was just wondering if I should tile the floor under it first. Option 2 the screw fixing sounds like the go and I could take your advice and mark out and pre drill the fixing holes in the tiles before laying them.
Both the waste pipe position and water supply inlet are correctly located so that is one less thing to worry about.
Yeh put the tiles down first - unless you think you can do the cuts to fit around the pan. drill the hole for screws in tiles before laying. Even with the greatest care tiles can still crack when you try and drill them.