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Well there was Strathfield in Sydney in '89. Six or seven were killed in that one.Quote:
Originally Posted by MajorPanic
Then there was Surry Hills in '90, that took about 5 I think.
Of course there was Hoddle Street in Melbourne in ('87?) can't remember the numbers but it was more than 5. That Julian Knight must be getting toward the end of his sentence too :mad:
And not forgetting Queen St, also in Melbourne.
So, to answer your question; quite a few.
Whoops. You are right. A slip of the finger, the one I use to type.Quote:
Originally Posted by outback
There have been 13 massacres between 1987 & 1996 Australia wide... only one used an assult rifle. (only a quick internet search was carried out) So that means that all the others were carried out using CURRENTLY, easily available weapons including KNIVES.Quote:
Originally Posted by craigb
There have been attacks & massacres since 1996 using other weapons besides auto weapons.
Care to name them ?Quote:
Originally Posted by MajorPanic
How did this get reduced to a debate about assault rifles?
Possibly because this was what it was all about. While it's hard to justify a thumpin' great big cannon for most jobs, the only reason to have an assault rifle is to attack men. Even pig hunters, while they might appreciate an AK 47 or an SLR, have other semi-automatic weapons they can choose from.Quote:
Originally Posted by craigb
I see no reason why ANY australian need own an operative assault rifle.
On the other hand, why the hell shouldn't he?
Why should we, the majority (who will never own one), restrict the ownership of the minority?
Because, there is no need for that ownership and some have used them for horrible purposes.
This is difficult for me because I see no earthly reason for owning these weapons in an operative state, ie, outside a collection. Sorry, I don't see artificial target shooting competitions as justification because there are better, specialist weapons for such a purpose and so, the need to own an assault rifle, is just that, artificial.
However, I don't see why someone should be prevented from wasting his own money to purchase a completely useless piece of equiptment if he so chooses.
And then we head into the sticky territory of men on the land, in their various guises, who may feel they need one of these rifles. But, do they need an AK47 to hunt pigs rather than a civilian semi-automatic weapon? I dunno. I've never faced a grumpy pig.
But, we do know that the perpetrators of the few masacres we've had have used this sort of weapon and why shouldn't they? If you wanted to smooth a plank of wood, wouldn't you choose the plane designed to do the job? The trouble is, these weapons ending up in the hands of the nut cases. Sadly, the current laws do **** all to address this. I'm quite sure that any of our mass murderers of history could legally acquire the weapons to repeat their crimes if they chose to.
So, are the current laws wrong?
I wouldn't go that far. I'd say they were ineffective. However, they do restrict the impulse killer. Whether the democratic price we pay justifies this, I don't know. Philosophically, I'd say it doesn't. However, we are probably a safer society for those laws. The nutters can get the weapons if they choose to, but they would have anyway.
But, rather than get picket marks in my bum from sitting on the fence, I'm afraid I have to support democracy and choose that these weapons be available, with efficient and appropriate control (which the current laws pay lip service to) and if it came to a vote, that's the way I'd vote. However, I'm not going to march to have those laws repealled, because the controls we have now, while not efficient, are better than no controls at all.
Cheers
Richard
What is the essential difference, point, pull trigger, bang, reload and ready to go again in both instances.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daddles
Apart from the emotional crap put out by the media, killing machines etc, the AK47 is a crude device and nowhere near as refined as a sporting rifle, sloppy tolerances in the mechanisms although this was deliberate to allow for the gun to be dropped in mud and other assorted nasties and still be operational.
The pig shooters weapon of choice used to be a 30 calibre as used by the US Military and to shoot deer (oh dear, how can we kill such a beautiful animal) requires a minimum calibre, not being a shooter this does not affect me but I detest the way the media have pandered to the minority and swung government yet again.
Next I will have to register my cutlery and fly rods :mad:
Since when have guns been banned?
As far as I'm aware I'm still licensed and my guns are still registered. For anyone who thinks they need a semi-auto - get with the program. I went through 7 boxes of 22 bullets after the bushfires with an old bolt action, I couldn't have done it any quicker with a semi-auto nor would I have cared to. The only reason I've seen to own one is farming emu's/ostriches - but that's another story.
The farmers I shoot for are predominantly private fenced property - most now locking their gates to stop spotlighters, poachers and suburban 4wd clubs from inviting themselves in for a free-for-all.
Personally I see little problem with the current laws - they allow legitimate use for legitimate reasons. If you want to own a pistol - join a pistol club. If you want to own rifles or shotguns, hold a game license. It's pretty simple.
G'day,
On reading the nasty story in yesterdays Sun Herald I thought I'd add my 2 cents since the reporter went off saying how there are so many guns out there and what suburbs have the most. The suburb I live in wasn't mentioned, but that's beside the point.
Before my Dad passed away I asked him if I could have his air rifle - A Crossman 766 American Classic. The only reason I have a licence is to be able to legally own that gun.
Sitting and passing the licence test was simple, going throught the motions of getting a gun down from Brisbane to Melbourne was like jumping through 20 hoops at a circus. To ensure I did it all correctly I rang the Licencing Branch at Knox 3 times and got 2 different answers. Did the stuff I had to in Brisbane to the letter that I was told at the time, got it down here and found I did it incorrectly. Eventually it was sorted out.
To legally keep my gun and hold a licence I am a member of the Melbourne Uni Rifle Club, each Monday night I shoot at targets 10m away and hit a few bullseyes.
Sure you can proably find a gun on the black market, but I wouldn't have a clue as to how. Those who for whatever reason have a licence, understand expicitly the safety issues of being a safe gun owner. For my opinion we should be knocking off all feral animals in this great land of ours - foxes, wils pigs, wils cats, wild dogs (not dingos), and buffalo
I have a Category A Longarm Licence, if I had a Category E Licence I could own the ilk of a RPG, a cannon or a bazooka - now that could solve the problems of the myna birds that roam around my yard like a plauge at times, it would also solve the problem of getting rid of the cats that roam my yard that chase the mynas and other birds. Instead I'll stick to throwing rocks and lemons at the cats and scaring them half to death when I get up to 6' away from them.
As far as hunting is concerned, if you can't hit something with a bolt action rifle you're going to miss it with an AK47. Same goes for target shooting.
There's absolutely no place for auto and semi-auto in Australia I think, in many cases, it has more to do with an inadequate appendage size.
It is still perfectly legal to own a shanghai (slingshot) provided it does not have an arm-brace.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris!
They can be bought quite cheaply in disposals type shops, but of course I made my own the good old fashioned way(!) and powered it with some spear gun rubber.
While it is possible to shoot a glass marble through a pine paling with it, that sort of behavior does bring with it other consequences in suburbia.
My modern equivalent to a salt-peter laden shotgun, is my shanghai loaded with a handfull of frozen peas.
You can't miss, and can't do any harm, but the recalcitrant birds/cats don't come back after a couple of doses.
Dunno how the CSI vet clinic autopsies would read though.
P (anyone for crow pie and peas??)
:D :D :D
Chris!
I have a cat E licence but I'm afraid I can't own the weapons you mentioned.
As to safety under the new laws, yes there is less chance of being shot these days. The firearm homicide rate has been droping steadily since the early 70's with no long term interuption around the late 90's when these laws started.
On the other hand there is a higher chance of being murdered these days. The over all homicide rate started a sharp climb at about the same time the new laws were introduced. Was this caused by the laws or some other socal trend? I dont know.
Never seen an e cat, hard to hit? :D :D :D :D :DQuote:
Originally Posted by aussiecolector
G'day Aussiecollector,
I've always been intruged by the Category E licence and how you can own such weapons (not questioning why or casting any thing untowards). Given you are a collector I'm guessing that you have to have a firing pins etc. removed. Outside of owning them as a collector, are you able to own such big fellas for other reasons?
Oh the joys of Adam and Jamie on Mythbusters and if a thing doesn't work let's blow the thing up to get the biggest bang possible. :D
G'day Iain,
The only good cat is a dead cat, or one that's not in my yard. Maybe an E cat is like a bra size, which means that he's a big fella and probably easier to hit.
Chris
In Queensland at least a cat E wepond is a bullet proof vest also used to include telascopic battons which have been moved to cat M or "restricted". No firing pins to worry about. Most of the big stuff comes under cat R and hast to be "permantaly inoprable"
I dont own anything in cat E or R.