We Need To Make A Stand

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I dispute that there is any evidence for God.

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Then I said:

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If there is no evidence, then why are you not a 7?

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Then you said:

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But there is evidence...

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So, yes I am confused.

On the evidence thing, it's really very simple. Evidence consists of facts that may lead you to believe something to be true. It is not proof in and of itself. A fact might be that I found you with a knife in your hand that has the blood of a victim on it. This is evidence that you stabbed the victim but not proof. It goes to court, and the jury decides after all the evidence has been presented whether or not there is reasonable doubt that it was you who did it. Even that is not proof.

My point was that an atheist has no more proof of the non-existence of god than a theist has of his existence. You may have evidence that you consider satisfactory to your mind, but it is not proof. In fact, as has been pointed out, I don't think you can prove that god does not exist. So how can a logical thinking person rule it out? The best you can say is that it seems to you on the balance of probability that the existence of a god is unlikely. You cannot say he does not exist. Unless you are an atheist. And that is an illogical position. Not saying it's wrong, immoral, bad, stupid - just not logical.

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such I thing I think can never be proven one way or the other

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Existence of god can be proven, like the existence of life on other planets. All he needs to do is to appear. That would prove it. You can't prove that he doesn't exist.

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Originally Posted by Zed

I quite like Douglas Adams take on religion Ie the bit where he indicates that without faith god is nothing, and proof belies faith thus if you get proof it negates faith and removes the need for faith therefore god cant exist and thus vanishes in a puff of logic. or some such thing...

I love it. He must a spent some time navel contemplating over that one...

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:D

Your are in esteemed company then Zed. Richard Dawkins,who makes a living from debunking religion, cause's theoligists to poop their pants when they have to debate him and has and has provided some of the arguments that I have no doubt butchered, blundering my way trying to make a point, loves to quote Douglas Adams


cheers
BD:2tsup:

I used to be a devout atheist but all this theological discussion is causing me to have doubts......................


I'm starting to question my beliefs.......


What...what if there really is a god?:C


No, no I must be strong...... mustn't have faith!

I'm stunned that after all these pages and posts, no-one has yet responded to the agnostic dyslexic insomniac's quest.

He stays up all night wondering if there really is a Dog!


Where is Grunt when I need him?


P
:D

You said:

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100&#37;" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER- 1px inset; BORDER- 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">I dispute that there is any evidence for God. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Then I said:

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER- 1px inset; BORDER- 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">If there is no evidence, then why are you not a 7? </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Then you said:

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER- 1px inset; BORDER- 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">But there is evidence... </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

okay I did say that :D but what I was trying to say and when put into proper context was there is no evidence for God only against. Hope this dispells any confussion.

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It is not proof in and of itself

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On the evidence thing, it's really very simple. Evidence consists of facts that may lead you to believe something to be true. It is not proof in and of itself

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I agree, that is why I said I have to conceed the very small possibility of a God.

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My point was that an atheist has no more proof of the non-existence of god than a theist has of his existence

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My point was to stongly support a conclusion you only need more convincing evidence than the other side.

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You may have evidence that you consider satisfactory to your mind, but it is not proof.

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never said it was

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So how can a logical thinking person rule it out? The best you can say is that it seems to you on the balance of probability that the existence of a god is unlikely. You cannot say he does not exist. Unless you are an atheist. And that is an illogical position.

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I havent ruled it out. However only due to the fact that I cant prove non-exsitense. Proportionly I consider that fact to be irrelevent/insignificant when forming a phylosiphy on life.

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You cannot say he does not exist. Unless you are an atheist. And that is an illogical position.

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that statement only deals with absolutes ie. absolute Theism, Agnostism and Atheism. I have already stated that I dont consider atheism to be absolute...there is a spectrum. But if you want to deal with absolutes, that must mean you equally believe in the existance of God and the non exsitance...to me, with available evidence that is illogical.


cheers
BD:2tsup:

I think this thread has run it's course and should come to a closure with the following well balanced and considered sentiment.

There is no god, or spirits, or afterlife it is all nonsense - end of story. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by silentC

Existence of god can be proven,

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The existence or otherwise of God is very easily proven. Just top yourself and then you will know. Of course the knowledge will be useless, particularly if god doesn't exist

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Where is Grunt when I need him?

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Right here Midgee.

On Douglas Adams and God.

There are quite a number of good quotes from the HHGTTG Trilogy, (Yeah, I know there were 5 books).

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and more controversial than Oolon Colluphid's trilogy of philosophical blockbusters Where God Went Wrong, Some More of God's Greatest Mistakes and Who is this God Person Anyway?

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I'm gonna pray, man! Know any good religions?

- Zaphod Beeblebrox, "Hitchikers Guide"

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In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.

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We have got a bit side-tracked here by people who want to be the first to score 10,000 posts on the Forum. This thread is not about the existence of God, but about FC's allegation that women are getting depressed, anorexic, and even suicidal, because, he says, the media tell us that pre-marital sex and abortion are OK. Surely, at least 50&#37; of the people who engage in pre-marital sex, leaving aside, for the moment, people like Elton John and Martina Navratilova, are women; and 100% of those who have abortions are also women. So, if these women are doing what they want to do, and the media are re-assuring them that it is OK, why would they be depressed, anorexic, or suicidal? Could it be that FC disapproves of pre-marital sex and abortion, and wants women who engage in such activities to be as miserable as possible? He probably doesn't even approve of Elton getting married either; some people are very hard to please.

Rocker

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Originally Posted by bitingmidge

He stays up all night wondering if there really is a Dog!

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Well hello people, of course there is a Dog, and if you look real close like, and pay attention to the speeling, you will notice if you spell DOG backwards, you get GOD. :o

So to spell it out for all you fine folk, if you speel DOG backwards, you get GOD.

I hope you all learn something from this.

Why hasn't this thread been deleted yet? :?

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Originally Posted by craigb

Why hasn't this thread been deleted yet? :?

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Cause everyone needs a good laugh once in a while, besides, its a full moon.

Al :)

Dunno bout anyone else but to plagiarise Cliffy
Who gives a rats about 10,000 posts

Come to think about it,
Who gives a rats about this inane thread anyway

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Originally Posted by craigb

Why hasn't this thread been deleted yet? :?

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Because there is a God!!

P
:D :D :D