Security System - Scumbags Strike

Our good neighbours over the road have just been rolled. The Scumbags smashed a backwindow. Neighbours where only out for a couple of hours. I'd taken the kids bike riding and SWMBO was doing the house cleaning thing. Nobody seems to have heard or seen anything. We all have security screens and deadlocks etc but this doesn't seem to stop a druggo from smash and grab.

So tomorrow the Squizz Monster is off to look for a basic security system. People up the street got the whole whizzBang works. Costs them every month, and went off everytime a cockroach broke wind. Was so useless they had it disconnected. I'm just looking for something basic for the hooligans.

Any suggestions? (moving to Switzerland is out because they don't have jarrah there) (and the baseball bat thing is out as well...lets not go there)
I hear some of the sensors are wireless now??. We are getting a dog but our good neighbours had one too!. I don't mind spending a couple of hundred if its going to help in some way.


Cheers

A reasonable sized dog.
I have a Red Heeler.
Nobody can get in the yard with out me being notified. :eek:
She barks then comes to me and makes sure I go and check who it is.
Good company too. :)

Dick Smith advertises a variety of security units that can be self installed. I know nothing about them.
My daughter and her husband live in a vulnerable part of Perth and have had 2 breaks in 12 months. They have some security but, obviously, not enough.

David, The neighbours have a bull terrier

Rob, there is little difference in Perth, it happens everywhere, because of drugs which is everywhere. A few bad burbs although the actual difference in crime rates is not much. The forensic copper who just left told us he attends between 10 & 20 households a day. Makes you wonder. I'll look at the tricky dicky online. I was hoping to find a member with experience in the industry.

Cheers

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Originally Posted by vsquizz

I'm just looking for something basic for the hooligans.

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Ben. :D

Squizzy

Just as a point when I was selling security screens and burgular alarms one thing a lot of people did initially was to put stickers on all the windows saying that the place was alarmed and I think you can buy dummy boxes with a blue light on them to put up high on a gable or somewhere and this will certainly deter them.

They are smart enough to pick the softest target over one that could be potentially more risky.

That may be helpfull in the short term.

David as long as the bull terrier is not a staffy because I have a staffy and he just wags his tail and invites everyone in no matter who they are.

Ben, A fine piece of engineering, but anything like that is too quick and painless, plus there is the mess. The only good thing to come out of the neighbours experience is the scumbags cut themselves on the window and left blood everywhere. The copper said once its in the DNA database its in there for good, see Big Brother can be a good thing. The copper gave my neighbour about 10 pairs of rubber gloves to help with the clean-up and must have said about 15 times, "don't get the blood on you".

Anyway, Yes way to quick for these types Ben. I've had some other ideas and SWMBO is keen on the razor wire and claymores, which could also help with the local cat problem.

Cheers

At work we get attempts on a regular basis - very desirable gear and a lot of it. Occasionally successful. The one thing that really stops them is physical security. Leave a computer next to an accessible window without bars on it and it's going to get nicked, alarm system or not.
So my suggestion: make it bloody difficult for them to get in. High side gates that are always locked, and fences around the back are probably the best first steps for a home IMHO. If your workshop is in a building with a roller door, bolt the bloody thing closed - roller door locks are pretty useless. Deadlocks on doors and locked windows also help. Alarms aren't too expensive - but as someone else mentioned, sticking up a siren, box & blue light outside and the stickers on the windows gets you 80% of the way there anyway, for not a lot of money.

Personally I wouldn't entirely trust a wireless alarm system. Wired models are more reliable, you don't have to worry about batteries, and it's really not that big a deal to install one.

Obviously, you could go the full hog and have door and window sensors, but in my humble opinion....some well placed PIR's is all you need connected to the main unit.

When selecting a Control Unit, ensure it has programmable entry / exit times because it will depend on where you place the keypads as to how much time you will need to disarm the system.

Also a handy feature to have is a "Sentry" feature. This means you can go to bed at night, and when there is movement detected by one of the PIR's, an audible beep can be heard from the keypad....but it doesn't set off the whole works, and scare the crap out of you. ( Great for when kids have a tendancy to go walkabout of an evening ).

Squizzy do a search I am pretty sure this subject was pursued a while ago with some reccommendations.
Cheers
Barry

Thanks Guys. The PIR's are definetly on the shopping list. Choice recommends getting one with a dialer so it rings your mobile if it goes off??. I know some people with monitored systems but the mob who monitor it don't/can't do anything useful and the cops are to busy. Always too late for $$$$per month

Baz, I did a search and went back a fair way and didn't find anything relavent. Maybe I have to go further?. I did find one mention of the systems whereby a PIR sets a camera off and the video recorder kicks in...Could be useful as the camera can be used as a general monitor.

My problem with improving physical security is that I already have security screens on the sliding part of the window but the scumbags just smash the unprotected part or easier still, just lift as few roof tiles. Roll on the corrugated iron:( .

The neighbours are devasted, locksmith and glazier on a sunday, beauty. Then there's the late model car which has to have the security code and barrels changed etc etc. Makes my blood boil.


Cheers

The stickers and blue light are useful, but even more so is a flashing LED in a prominent place. There are high output LEDs that are extremely visible during the day and from far away at night. The important thing is to make the burglar think that it could go off if he attempts and then go off and look for what perceives to be a softer target.

I originate from South Africa and never had a burgulary there....used to loose the odd screw driver or setspanner that fits a bicycle. I'm not talking about violence but about the normal burgularies here. I got my shed cleaned out here in Perth on two occasions, once they definately got away with 2 ute and 2 trailer loads! I can tell you that they were painful experiences. Burgular alarm systems incorporating the stickers, blue lights and extra LED's in strategic places has kept them from trying ever since. Often trouble is invited by neighbours not thinking and telling people that you do a lot of work in your shed, or your open garage door while working advertises to all who passes that you have a lot of gear.......... make sure that your gear is not visible from the street!

Good luck..........the alternative is painful especially if they get away with what one has collected meticulously over a lifetime! Prevention is the name of the game.


:mad:

And dont forget to engrave all your goodies as per police protocol.
This makes it *harder* for them to sell quickly, and easier to identify if recovered.

Also, make sure your insurance covers your goods, especially the tools. Search for recent threads on both topics :)

Does anybody know if you can power up a relay from the PIR built into the Arlec Floodlights/movement sensor lights. So you could activate something in the house to let you know the light is on????Ahhh Dean, lets say I have a fair handle on the insurance aspect, thanks.

Cheers

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Originally Posted by vsquizz

Ahhh Dean, lets say I have a fair handle on the insurance aspect, thanks.

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Just added it as a reminder for any other thread-following readers :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vsquizz

Does anybody know if you can power up a relay from the PIR built into the Arlec Floodlights/movement sensor lights. So you could activate something in the house to let you know the light is on????Ahhh Dean, lets say I have a fair handle on the insurance aspect, thanks.

Cheers

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If all you want is an indicator that the outside light is on, run a parallel cable from the light socket that is activated by the PIR...and plug in another light bulb. Less messier than fiddling with relays etc.

Thanks Gaza, Not quite sure what you mean. The floodlight is plugged into a power point down the side of my house whilst I'm doing reno work. I understand about running a parrallel cable but how/where to I pick up the activation??


Cheers

Let me pre-tense this with the following :
240V very dangerous.

Now that we are passed that, all I am saying is that the PIR activates the light bulb or flood light. If an electrician was to connect a cable in parallel to the bulb's socket, ( and connect a standard 240V Lightbulb ), you would then have a secondary indicator for when the PIR is activated.

If this light bulb is too bright, get the electrician to place a standard socket at the end of this parallel cable, and plug in a Child's Night Light which would be much dimmer.

did some research on this myself recently. Haven't made the plunge yet though.

if you've got a dog you can get systems which are set to above the height of the dog ( no good for cats or for burglars who crawl along the ground ).

the wireless systems can have anti-tamper mechanisms so that if someone tries to smash a PIR / remove the batteries when the control unit doesn't believe that the batteries are meant to be being replaced then the alarm will go off.

On subject of insurance just had a call from my new insurer after I wrote to them confirming some verbal information given to me by their salesperson.

Turns out that the policy I have been sold

a) doesn't meet my needs ( although I was assured that it did )
b) doesn't insure me for as much as I was told that I was insured for specified items.

So if you discuss anything "special" with your insurer make sure that you write to them to confirm your understanding if it doesn't appear on the policy doucments that you receive. Don't just assume that because you told them something that they have it on record.

I don't know yet whether the salesperson was being keen to make a sale and deliberately misrepresented the policy or whether his training wasn't up to standard.

Fortunately we live in a low-crime area (midges keep the bad guys away too it would seem).... but I did have occasion to waste an intruder Friday night.

Sensor lights activated... I got up to see why...nothing...back to bed, same thing twice more..... I staked out the place, then when he came back I donged the bastard on the back of the head with a bit of 8 x 3 hardwood.

Bloody Cane Toads!

As for bad guys..no I am not about to divulge what we have installed at home, but have enough experience to know that bad guys, particularly those with a habit, are NOT deterred by anything that won't eat them.

I have the movie of three of them removing the 120 kg safe from my shop (not near where I live) at 5.30am one sunny summer's morning if you wish. (30 minutes before staff arrive). Clear shots, 10 minutes of movie, three years ago, no arrest.

Broad daylight, busy street even at 5.30 am. Oxy, sledge hammer, 8" grinder, alarms blazing, hammer through 12mm laminated "bullet proof" glass in the front door. 8 robberies in 9 years and they haven't woken up that the glass windows beside the door are plain old 6mm safety glass! To our knowledge three of the perpetrators have been caught.

Have you ever walked past a shop in daylight hours with the blue light flashing?? It's people like you that my robbers love!!

Dogs of any description are statistically the best deterrant, even small yappy ones, but big bitey ones are more satisfying in this instance!

There is a gas which can be rigged to fire when the alarm is triggered, which basically is a smoke screen to prevent the buggers finding your goodies, or their way out, and I have thought about it! Dunno about for home though!

Cheers,

P :eek:

I read all the answers to Squizzy's question and I noticed only one thing missing. If you do not have neighbours that are home, or care about others it is pointless having an alarm. How many times have you heard an alarm and just carried on about your own business?
There are alarms that can be only used inside that make a sound so piercing it makes it impossible to stay in the house.
another thing is the time an alarm can sound: Some states have a time limit on alarm activity and the owner can be fined for over use.
Movement activated alarms can be set off by a bird looking at themself in their reflection of your window.
The stickers do have some value, and so would a sign that says : "This property is protected by a loaded shotgun three days a week, you guess which days!"
You have been given great advice, Squizzy, but always, locks only keep honest people out.
It is interesting, the law thing and Beware signs. If you have a savage dog and put a Beware of the Dog sign on your gate you are admitting liability for any action that your dog takes and could find yourself in more trouble than if you don't have the sign.
PS: as the action of your sensor light requires the switching of a circuit of electricity it should be possible to connect a light or buzzer in line - that is a good thought.
Luck!
Peter R.

Thanks for all the comments. For the neighbours, well they are talking about selling up and moving out, the problem is where to?. I watched Mrs Neighbour come home yesterday. Mr Neighbour had one car down the dealers getting the locks changes etc. She could hardly face to go in the house with their 2 year old. Its very sad. Bugger the material items.

Headline here awhile back "17 year bashes 81 year old grandma in home invaision"

I'm stuffed if I know what to do. Put in some more security and hope for the best.

I believe that when you knowingly break the law then you begin to forfeit the rights and protection of the law. The victims should be protected but it seems a lot of people are hell bent in putting the scumbags back where they can cause us more sorrow and heartache.

I just know (because of the bloodline) that if Mr Neighbour catches one of these scumbags there will be big trouble. But who is the real victim. So Scumbags, I'll go off and spend some of my hard earned money to try and keep my family safe:mad:

I'm still interested in the hook up to video if anybody has any experience with the hardware.

Cheers and thanks again

Squizz,

Did they have keys stolen? Is that why they are changing all the locks? If not, they are wasting their money.

In relation to alarms, get the loudest, most piercing alarm that you can. One that comes on after about 20 secs after you walk through the door. Just enough time for you to disable it when you get home, not enough for crooks to have more than a quick look around. The plan is that the crook will cra p when the alarm goes off and do the bolt.

Monitered silent alarms are basically useless. By the time the security company calls 000 and the job then gets given to the police and then the police have to get there from wherever they are, the crooks are well gone with your TV and VCR. Or worse still with your other half's jewellery box or THE WORST of the lot, your tools :eek:

Video is not a bad idea, BUT, is only any good if the person video'd is known to someone who sees the vid. Keep this in mind and don't get disappointed if your video does not hand the crook to the coppers on a platter.

Regarding Roof Tiles being moved to get in, I have never been (in eight years) to a burglary where they moved tiles. If you like to feel safer in this regard, nail every course of tiles down. It won't stop someone who is truly determined but they will make a huge racket getting the tiles off.

Someone earlier said something about detering honest thieves. I have to dispute this saying. There is no such thing as an honest thief. They are opportunist thieves. :mad: Their behavior in itself is dishonest.

To make the neighbours feel better tell them to leave a $10 note in a prominent spot just inside the place they enter the house. If they open the house and the note is gone, they close the door, go to a neighbour and call the police. Crooks will always grab cash before anything else.

Dan

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Originally Posted by DanP

Video is not a bad idea, BUT, is only any good if the person video'd is known to someone who sees the vid. Keep this in mind and don't get disappointed if your video does not hand the crook to the coppers on a platter.

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Don't the bad guys know that too! They aren't deterred!

A friend of mine had an armed hold-up in his shop, only had $30 - something in his till at the time and a time lock on the safe. Bad guy spotted the camera, and asked where the VCR was, then proceeded to the cupboard at the back of the shop and knocked off the VCR!

Now his cameras are hidden too! (and connected to a PC hard drive out of harms way, and accessible via the internet.)

Cheers,

P :D

Dan yes they got the spare house keys and car keys/immobilizer. Two streets down coppers found blood at another break in, same morning. From our neighbours Scumbag took some kids DVD's but left a $300 bottle of Scotch, go figure. They also took 2 solar garden lights???, the jewelery, video, wallet etc.

Dan, local Neighbourhood vigil...sorry, watch.. told me of a couple of recent break-ins in the next suburb where through the roof tiles to gain entry and then out the front door.

I'm less happy because I have to take down the whole fence on one side of my place shortly to put up a retaining wall.

I may put in a monitor for internal purposes rather than recording.

Mrs Neighbour has been calling the security system snake oil sales types and they are flocking to her door, mouths foaming at the potential sale. From what I could see the $1,000 wireless system (installed) was exactly the same system available DIY for $400 at Tricky Dickies. Its wireless for Pete's sake, takes longer to read the manual than it does to install. The PIR's were absolutley identical.

They all seem to have window sensors, well sorry but this is WA. We can't actually remember fully closing our windows?, thats what we have security screens for, so we can have some air.

I'm starting to rant..

Cheers

I've got a daft idea,

Put a good strong dose of drugs available if your lucky they might overdose themselves :D

Hi, DanP, If your referred to my comment where you said 'someone said honest theives' (sic) and took exception to that comment, I might suggest that you read again as I said locks only keep honest people out.
I do hope that your powers of obversation weren't used to solve the robberies that you attended.

Peter R.

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Originally Posted by vsquizz

\ From what I could see the $1,000 wireless system (installed) was exactly the same system available DIY for $400 at Tricky Dickies. Its wireless for Pete's sake, takes longer to read the manual than it does to install. The PIR's were absolutley identical.

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Choice did a think on burglar alarms and if memory serves me right they reckoned you were just as well off installing it yourself.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Peter R

If your referred to my comment where you said 'someone said honest theives' (sic) and took exception to that comment, I might suggest that you read again as I said locks only keep honest people out.
I do hope that your powers of obversation weren't used to solve the robberies that you attended.

Peter R.

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Peter,

Your post reminded me of a saying that is commonly used. I worded my post poorly. If you are offended by my post, and it seems that you are, then I apologise.

I do not take kindly to your commenting on my ability in my chosen occupation. You do not know me and have no right to pass such comment. :mad:

Dan

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DanP

Peter,

Your post reminded me of a saying that is commonly used. I worded my post poorly. If you are offended by my post, and it seems that you are, then I apologise.

I do not take kindly to your commenting on my ability in my chosen occupation. You do not know me and have no right to pass such comment. :mad:

Dan

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Yeh! Sorry Dan, didn't mean to get catty. I was not offended by your comment, just bemused at the fact that the comment had no basis, if in fact, the comment came from my statement. Let's shake and make up, OK?

Peter R.

Quite honestly, dont waste your money.
The alarms go off so regularly in our street nobody takes notice anymore

The last time an alarm sent off I telephoned the local police station and they asked me to take a look and let them know if there were any prowlers.

In fact last month somebody telephoned there local police station at midday to complain about a prowler and when the police turned up 5 hours later they found the couple DEAD from gunshot wounds.

Get the wife to stay at home and not go out to work , I 'm sure the lady would see them off the premises

Peter,

Consider yourself shook. :cool:


Jow,

Obviously the police in Pommyland either have no sense of priority OR they are that busy and understaffed that they can't get anywhere quicker than that.

Have seen that here but not to the point where hot jobs take hours to get to.

Dan

Dan, Got some stuff and following your advice. Local boys-in-blue dropped past yesterday with some hopeful news. Turns out that DNA is unique to an individual. Now isn't that interesting.;)

Cheers

Squizz,

DNA is as unique as a fingerprint and it is a lot easier to get a DNA sample than a usable fingerprint. Being that your crook cut himself, they will have a DNA profile on the crook. If they have all ready taken a sample from the crook at some stage, they will get a match and he can be convicted on that evidence alone. Hopefully your crook has been bad in the past and they have a previous sample on the database.

If you set your own alarm up, might I suggest that you position your sensors in such position that they face likely points of entry (windows and doors) but put them in such a position that is away from any windows or doors. They are vulnerable from underneath - If the crook can get under them he can cover them without setting them off. So don't put them above windows or doors either (If you can help it).

Dan

Dan, we don't know if the scumbag is in the database but we do know that it was the same scumbag that left blood at another robbery, the proceeds of which have been turning up providing a lead. Hopefully the coppers will get him before my neighbour does.

I was just talking to one of the security mobs and he said the same thing about the location of the sensors.


Cheers, thanks for the independent advice.

1. Get a dog or two.

2. We live in one of the dodgier neighbourhoods in the area, and the first thing I did was introduce myself to everyone within about a 4 house radius. We have been able to scope for safe houses for the kids, and we always let a couple of the neighbours know when we are heading off for a day or two.

3. The outside of our house (and we have friends who subscribe to this theory as well) is relatively grotty - needs a new coat of paint. No need to advertise that we are doing okay on the inside, just yet.

4. The only visible 'valuable' is the TV and DVD player, everything else is stashed in little hidey holes (Wireless network, music system and so on)

5. Our house is in a permanent state of dissarray, any potential thief would have to clean up first before they could find stuff to knock off.

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Originally Posted by namtrak

1. Get a dog or two.

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I no longer have a dog, :( he was a good mate but he did cause a bit of trouble, enough that I was forced to send him into exile out on a cattle property. That's him in my avatar, he was a great watchdog and even a few years after he was gone people would stop at my closed gate and yell out for me to chain him up before they were game to enter! Of course, I never let on he was gone :D

Mick

To Mick
Are you sure that it was the dog they were worrying over?

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Originally Posted by journeyman Mick

...... :( he was a good mate ......Mick

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They all are! Ours is a bluey as well, he's been in more strife than a bum on Oxford St.

I know it is a bit expensive in the first place, but consider 6.5mm laminated glass in the windows. As well as almost stopping smash and grab, it cuts down heat exchange (especially if tinted), cuts down noise, and stops those tree branches coming through the window in those big storms some of us get. Possibly works out cheaper than security screens and much better to look through. Also easier to clean than windows covered with security screens.
Replace your current glass a few windows at a time , ie when one breaks, or windows in hidden or other vunerable spots first.
Also safer in case of fire as you can easily open from inside whereas most window security screens cannot be opened at all (don't keep windows locked when at home - window locks are usually only to stop people who get in through a roof, etc, from getting out carrying your TV).
Regards
Don