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When finishing a surface such as a coffee/side table with estapol or similar varnish I usually only go down to 180 or 240 git sanding paper. I seems to me that thin coats of the varnish sanded back lightly between a few coats gives as good a finish as possible. What are your thought on this? What size grit do you use & why that size? As a newbee to this stuff I am looking for advice to improve my final products.:)
What sort of finish do you want? Gloss, matt ?Quote:
Originally Posted by RIMP
If gloss, I go 180,240, 400, 800, then EEE polish from our host www.ubeaut.com.au
Brilliant, especially if you use a swansdown mop, also from Ubeaut.
And use Minwax Wipe-on Poly, not varnish. (avail at Bunnings) www.minwax.com
I sand 100-150-240 grit with aluminium oxide (white) paper then use Danish Oil rubbed in with 400 grit wet and dry. Comes up as smooth as glass but not necessarily high gloss.
Steph
The idea of sanding is to flatten the surface. On a table top you have the most critical surface to look at so any finish will easily show up imperfections. So you need to plane and sand to get it dead flat.
Wood having grain has cells which show on the surface, when you sand there is no point in using really fine paper as the grain will always be a series of small hollows. If you look at the most dense timber under a microscope when you sand with abrasive paper you will find that after about 400 you are sanding and not making the surface any better, the grain is larger than the sanding marks you are putting in.
If you use a paint (varnish/lacquer/whatever) the exercise is to fill the grain and produce a smooth surface. Usually estapol type finishes can fill in about 2-3 coats depending on the timber. The final result will depend on how well you managed to apply the finish. If you spray it may be peely or worse and if you brush it may show the brush marks. I think thats why Gumby has sugggested using the mop it is easier to get a better finish if you arn't used to the material.
Sanding the coats of paint should be done to improve the surface, take out dirt specks, orange peel, brush marks etc. Its also done to help the next coat adhere but there is no point rubbing if you do it poorly or don't use a block of some type. On shaped pieces you can use your hand but you should use a block on flat surfaces to keep the surface flat, The paper and block acts like a wood plane and only takes off the high spots.
In between coats use a finer abrasive (800 is more than fine enough) but if you rub the final coat after its dry the surface will be scratched. Real fine paper such as 1500 will make it smooth but Estapol dries so hard it will be difficult to polish out the scratches, thats when waxes come in to play they fill the scratches. Estapol is meant to be finishes out of the can to gain the maximum gloss ( if thats what you want) but your application technique will decide this.
In other words how well did you apply it and that requires you to have the material thinned correctly for the temperature of the day, for what method you choise to use brush spray gun etc.
I was just wondering, in this day and age....with what is available.............why anybody would use Estapol
too true.Quote:
Originally Posted by watson
One of the best 'Estapol' looking finishes I've used is the clear spray lacquer from the auto shop. About $20 a can, dries almost instantly and the finish is unbelievable. But I wouldn't say that in here, just keep it to your self. :wink:
Tee Hee!
I'm keeping that one right to myself! :wink:
But, my post was more like a query than a "put down" 'cos I'm still in learning phase myself.......and probably will be until I pop my clogs.
For furniture 120 to 150 is best.
Any finer and conventional stains may not adhere properly to the timber.
(Turners need to sand finer as all sanding is crossgrain)
there's not much point going past 240 gritt if you are using common poly or varnish.
Mirrotone recomend sanding to 180 gritt when spraying nitro...I tend to go to 400.
estipol still has it uses.
cheers
Looks like I'll have to lift my game Gumby. I checked out the sites you posted and will be getting some of that EEE & Minwax Wipe-on Poly to try out. :2tsup:
Steph I have use that one and like the results - good to know someone else does also! :D
durwood - that information is most helpful and I've cut and pasted that into my information file. What allowances do you make for tinners in your Estapol for different temperatures? Thinner when colder? How thin? :?
watson I use Estapol cause I'm new at the hobby and just starting to learn the how's and why's of the craft so I can do better!
Echindna - I'll store that one for future reference as I haven't got to staining wood - yet! :roll:
Soundman - Mirrotone? What? Where? How? I haven't heard of that at all. :no:
I appreciate the help you forum fellows in the know have offered - I believe it is better to ask a silly question than make a silly mistake. And I do want to do things better! :B
There are lots of people who look down on " crude " products like estipol, but they have their function and they are simple and reasonably easy to use and very commonly available.
BUT
beyond estipol there is a whole word of finishing options.... even with all those options at hand sometimes estipol (or similar) will still be the most appropriate choice.
If you trawl the back post of this forum there is a wealth of information.
Among all that information you will find many times posted the recomendation to get a coppy of the "polishers hand book" written by the patron of this board.
check out his main site here http://www.ubeaut.com.au/ubhome.htm.
and that is only part of the wonderfull world of finishing.
cheers
Good stuff Soundman - continuing to lift my sights with the new information - thanks.
Ron