Senseless and Stupid

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Originally Posted by SMH 24th November 2004

Ten minutes after Emile Doussett bought petrol at a Central Coast service station his car hurtled down a quiet suburban street, became airborne after hitting a bump and three young people were dead.

Mr Doussett's Nissan Skyline had been speeding at up to 180kmh before flying through the air for 40 metres and hitting a power pole.

The car split into pieces, the front flying a further 30 metres before coming to rest on the footpath beside Chamberlain Road, Wyoming.

The bodies of Mr Doussett, 20, and his front-seat passenger, Karl Homer, 33, were thrown up to 60 metres from the pole. In the rear of the vehicle, which had wrapped around the pole, lay the body of Natasha Schys, 15.

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Another three young lives cut off by stupidity. OK, one of them was 33 and old enough to know better but the driver was 20 and his other passenger was a 15 year old girl. They're all dead now. I'd hate to be the family of the driver because not only have they lost a son but he has also taken two other people away from their families.

This is nothing new, it's been going on for decades. I went to the police station on the day I turned 16 and 9 months to get my L plates. I got my Ps on my 17th birthday. Three days later I was pulled over doing 120kph in my V8 Falcon. I had my cousin in the car with me. Did it cross my mind that I could kill us both? No, I was indestructible. It makes me shudder to think of the things I did in that car. I survived but plenty of us don't.

My reason for writing this is that I have a son and I want to know how to stop him from doing the same thing when he's old enough to drive. There must be something because I couldn't stand to be one of those parents.

SC,

I'm as terrified as you of getting that phone call or knock on the door in the middle of the night, it would destroy me. I to did stupid things when I was young and by luck came through it. Maybe we should ask what would have prevented us doing the things we all know we did.

At the end of the day, dying is never at the front of mind for most young people so a different deterent is needed, one they'll dislike more than the thrill of being on the edge. It seems radical but if analysis proves these incidents are primarily in the evenings then maybe curfews for L and P platers could be imposed. Alternatively make the penalty for speeding (which seems to be the major cause of deaths) immediate loss of license for two years and them having to re-take the test.

A lot has been made of the driving course approach but if I'd been on such a course I think I would have felt even more indestructible not less.

There's my 2c worth.

HH.

Another option might be to limit the power of vehicles for under 21's ...

HH.

Don't let him play with video games.

I have this theory that kids are conditioned by them to the extent that if they "die" then it's "game over" and there is no consequence- just put another two bob in and start again!

On the other hand: my friends in the press reported all in the car were in their teens, and that the car was a Skyline GTR.

There was alot of hoo ha when the old "power war" happened with the Monaro/Falcon GT, and those cars were only sold to people with competition licences.

The GTR (Godzilla) is among the most awe-inspiriting things to drive.... 0-100 in less than five seconds, 250km speed limited, traction control on all four driving wheels.... but like all cars that are designed for speed, they need contact with the ground in order to stop.

My current flash car is not as quick as that, but still carries a warning in the manual, that the laws of physics still apply and one should not rely on the electronics to get one out of every situation.

Cars are so darned good these days that there is no "thrill" until the speeds attained are lethal...not much is going to help if you hit a pole sideways at 120k!

So firstly have them in cars that appear to be more thrilling than they are: the old mini was a great example, low and slow, but by golly it seemed like the speed of sound.

A licence system (or parents) which limits kids to minimal horsepower for a time, defensive AND advanced driving lessons, and NO PASSENGERS for the first six months or so worked for us, (but our kids are girls so that helped also :o).

A car club is the next thing as well..bury your anti-petrol head sentiments for a while .....take them to do the boy thing (or girl thing) under controlled conditions...social gymkhanas and other events will both bring them down to earth in a hurry regarding their own ability (you can use the family car), while giving them car handling skills that just might help, and maybe they'll get the message that it's ok to spin out on grass, where there is nothing to hit, but on a street it hurts!

End of rant, but all of those things probably stopped me from a similar demise, and our kids thankfully have all survived that danger time.

You pushed a bit of a button here I'm afraid!

Cheers,

P

I was like Silent, turned up at the local police station the day I was eligible etc. I was not that dramatic in what I did, I had been driving on the farm for some time, however I still did some dumb things and was in the car when others were doing them.

I am not sure that curfews would change all that much. In Arizona you are not legally able to drink in bars untill 21. They still catch people drinking younger and they are able to drive from 16. When we lived there a person out drinking from her 21st blood alcohol 0.18 missed seeing the line of flares marking an accident site on the freeway. She plowed into the back of a police car where a patrollmen was finishing the paperwork for a previous accident. The impact concertinered the doors shut and set the patrol car alight, three days before the patrollmens wedding. Why would a curfew be relevent in this case, it was 6am in the morning and she was heading home after having an allnighter. My old school has too many more examples to mention on this topic, some pure stupidity, others just plain unlucky.

We need a way of making these people responsible rather than banning them. That is not easy as responsibility comes with age and responsibilities and that is something that is not taught by many to their children and even when they do the media picture is to say others are responsible anyway.

Sorry for the rant, none of my high school class has died in this manner (20yrs on) however my two younger brothers years have been decimated from road accidents.

Darren,

There is nothing that will guarantee he will not do the same thing as you. You could decrease his chances of being as silly as us and perhaps that is done by example whilst bringing him up.

I was a bit of a rebel and probably would have driven slowly if the old geriatrics had encouraged me to drive fast. That was when as much emphasis was given to saying grace at the meal table as there was to drug taking including smoking and drinking and driving like an idiot. Well I didn’t quite see the importance of saying grace so I lumped all the advice into one basket and pitched it. Fortunately for me the illegal drugs didn’t play a part in my life.

With our kids we tried to differentiate between life threatening attitudes and etiquette and so far so good, they are both grown up and left home and leading lives we are proud of.

If only we could promote to younger ones that woodwork was something that is cool or whatever the latest word for fashionable might be (funky?). We could have young people challenging each other with great designs and they could even take us “oldies” on by laughing at our woodwork advice.

At least they would still be alive and the world of woodwork would be better off with the influx of fresh ideas from the most energetic in our society – the younger ones.

My first car was a Datto 120Y. 0-100 in 5 minutes and when it went over 100km/h it shook & rattled like buggery. I still did silly things but with the power, speed and accelleration limited it probably saved me more than once. Although I love V8's and fast cars there is no need for anyone to have a car capable of 180km/h. So Silent,I reckon buy your son a car with limited horsepower.
The local rag on the coast says that the 15 year old girls was pregnant, so that is 4 lives lost

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Originally Posted by PAH1

I am not sure that curfews would change all that much. In Arizona you are not legally able to drink in bars untill 21. They still catch people drinking younger and they are able to drive from 16.

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Not sure we're on the same page here PAH1. What I meant by curfew was cannot drive a car between 10pm and 6am or something like that, nothing to do with drinking. I think this has been discussed in the press recently not sure of all the +'s and -'s.

As an aside when I lived in California they had Curfews in San Jose where no-one under 17 I think it was could be out on the street after 9pm although this was in reaction to gang problems.

HH.

It's a combination of the aggressive approach kids have these days and the higher powered cars they drive. I started in a 1949 Austin A40 and graduated to VW Bettles and of course, a Combi (with bed, kitchen and surf racks angled down at the front) :D

I pranged the A40 once, but not bad and nobody hurt. Yes , we did silly things but we never hit 120kmh....not even down hill with a strong tail wind.

I'd definitely limit the horsepower for the first 3 years !

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Originally Posted by HappyHammer

Not sure we're on the same page here PAH1. What I meant by curfew was cannot drive a car between 10pm and 6am or something like that, nothing to do with drinking. I think this has been discussed in the press recently not sure of all the +'s and -'s.

As an aside when I lived in California they had Curfews in San Jose where no-one under 17 I think it was could be out on the street after 9pm although this was in reaction to gang problems.

HH.

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I was just adding that the accident mentioned involved a tragic accident, out of curfew hours, through deliberate stupidity on the part of the person concerned. Nobody can legislate or allow for all acts of stupidity. Nothing will actually prevent idiots driving during those hours and they are mostly the ones that cause the trouble. It may sound like a solution but you then need to get the police to patrol it and enforce it and they really have enough other things to do.

Like Darren this day is getting closer for me, my son will be eligable for his learners permit in less than two weeks, so this topic has been at the fore for a while.

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There is nothing that will guarantee he will not do the same thing as you. You could decrease his chances of being as silly as us and perhaps that is done by example whilst bringing him up.

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This is the aproach I'm taking.

I am still amazed that I am alive or worse didn't kill somebody else in my youth. I worry as you do about what will happen, that's what being a parent is about I guess.

I started the process on my son some time back, when DAD knew everything. I'm hoping that those lessons are now entrenched.

These days I'm more often ignored until somebody else says the same thing and then I'm looked at as if I'm some sort oracle that could predict the ways of the world. I was the same.



HH,
Limiting the power of the vehicle doesn't work, just look at the motor cycle thing. In South Australia you are not allowed to have a bike more than 250cc until you are off P plates, yet I was able to wring the life out of a four stroke 250 Honda and get it upto 200km/h (this was on the track). that was fifteen years ago, I'd hate to think what some of them are capable of now.

I think the only thing we as parents can do is educate them, trust them and worry like crazy whenever they are out. After all didn't your parents do the same.

Himzo.

Talk to this man......


"After his stepson survived a near-fatal accident in 1999, Frank Bottomley from Batemans Bay launched his own campaign called "Stop The Four O'Clock Knock". He has held about 40 seminars across NSW. "The number of kids we get shows they really do want to know about staying safe," he said."

Himzo,

I think you're right on providing a good example and this is harder for some of us than others. I believe my road rage problem is a direct result of seeing my Dad do it when I was young and me believing he is the Oracle. My tongue is already bleeding from the number of times I've biten it whilst the kids are in the car. My daughter is 3 and is already saying "faster faster" when we're in the car.:eek:

I think we had something similar for motorbikes in the UK but the limit was 50cc for the first year or something.

HH.

my mum encouraged all of us girls to ride motorbikes because she reckoned we were safer doing that than being passengers in cars driven by stupid young men. I had a very mis-spent youth speedwise (though my nerve failed at about 130 mph - the bike had more left) and put my survival down to a combination of luck and being but was very selective about when and where I did my speeding. on a bike you stuff up and you're dead at best and in a wheelchair as a vegetable at worst.

I'd go for compulsory year riding a motorbike before you can get a car license. if we empty the lower end of the gene pool as a result then so be it. Anyone who's too dumb to work out that you can seriously damage yourself on 2 wheels after attending the funerals of a few mates is probably not worth worrying about ( although their families have my sympathy).

I had a row with a guy at work who was so scared that his son would get a motorbike that he was going to buy him a car because that way if he did something stupid ( and he was quite open about the fact that he EXPECTED him to do something stupid ) then the son wouldn't get hurt as badly. I was appalled at my colleague's disregard for the safety of everyone else on the road. My stance was that I'd far rather that his son killed himself on a bike than crashed into another road user or killed a passenger in his car. This didn't go down well with the doting father but I still hold the opinion.

Having been one of those persons who has done the "4 o'clock knock" on many occasions and also had to extricate lifeless poor souls from wrecks over many years I am still at a loss as how to stop this carnage.
I think no matter how much education we instill, laws, curfews, restrictions on horsepower etc we impose the deaths will still continue. A lot of it is the 'macho factor' similar to that what SilentC mentioned - once you have a licence + a car you think you are indestructable and go for it.
I'm not saying everyone does it but there are many out there that do.
Look at the so called 'hoons' now in the souped up 4 cylinder rockets. Some of these things can do well over 100mph and that's stock standard before they are "hotted up".
Some young persons don't respect their driving licence and think it is a right not a privilege to have one and lo and behold anyone who tries to take it from them.
Education by parents, family and authorities may well help in some way but I think it will be a long time till we can come up with a good solution to the problem and until then we will still see & watch news reports as we did the other night with those poor 3 young persons.
I can assure you that doing the 4 o'clock knock was just as devastating for me as it was for the famileis too. My last one, and hardest of all, was my neighbours over the road when their son was tragically killed - it was the straw that broke the camel's back for me. Haven't and couldn't do another one since.