I wasn't "One of the boys"

[peter_sm]

I have painted our old 50's weatherboard house. The old 3" downpipes were pretty rough looking, and painted the old colour, so I went to get new ones.

I know the eaves are 450mm, and the vertical distance from the gutter to the stormwater inlet is 2800mm.

I go to the local plumbing supplies, and explain exactly what I require, and the measurements I took for the eaves, and the drop.

I asked for gal downpipe, and get told with a rolled eye look.
"You mean zinc"
"Ummm yeah, that's the one" I reply
"Does it all come as one piece?" I then ask
"It's an offset you want isn't it?" He asks back sharply
"What's an offset?"
"Well if you have eaves you have to go back towards the house, or do you want it to go straight down to the ground?" He asks me with a bit of tone.

This is where I was getting a bit annoyed, and ready to head off to Bunnies. I explained again what the house was, and added that it is just like 95% of all the old 50's weatherboard houses in this area, the length of the drop, and just to supply me with two sets of what I need to replace what was there, along with a couple of brackets for each one.

He turns without saying anything, gets the bits, dumps the appropriate items on the counter, gives me an invoice, and I pay and leave.

I honestly wonder what I did wrong, or is it that I am just not "one of the boys"

[Honorary Bloke]

I
I honestly wonder what I did wrong, or is it that I am just not "one of the boys"

Got it in one. :rolleyes: Happens all the time. When going to places that deal mostly with tradies, you will often get frozen out if you can't speak the lingo. DAMHIKT. :rolleyes: Three choices, really:

Avoid going there
Learn the lingo
Put up with it

:D

[JMB]

Being a female woodworker I am sometimes treated in a similar manner to how you were treated when I go into hardware stores or timber yards. I always try to know the name of what I am after and find taking a deep breath before I go in to the store helps! If the people are a bit rude or unpleasant I usually dont bother going back unless I have no choice.

[Pheonix]

Go buy a handyman book so you can familiarise yourself with all these terms,there are plenty around.:U

[Ian Wells]

I'm 6'2', very blokey and wear the right coloured overalls and still I get the sniffy response from 9 out of10 timber/hardware/plumbing/electrical supply store employees.
In my mind they are just "shop assistants" until they decide to mature, learn to do their job properly and loose the attitude. Those that do get my business, those that don't, will continue to get their time wasted by me as I ask them endless and pointless bloody questions out of malicious spite.
I'm a bad man... \:wink:

[underfoot]

you need to understand

that in doing their job ,

selling you timber, tools,and hardware, etc

as they watch you load all the goodies into your car

and enthusiastically drive off to your next project,:D

they are constantly reminded

that they are selling,

and not making:((

[corbs]

I think it is more an attitude change over the years. It used to be that as a customer I have the money and I was doing them a favour by purchasing their product. Now it seems to be they think they are doing me the favour by having the product that I want:((. I will support businesses which support their product and provide assistance when required.

Corbs

[Chesand]

What they do not realise that if customers do not come in, the business fails, they have no job. Retailing is that simple.

[munruben]

I certainly wouldn't be going back to that supplier again, there is no need for that kind of an attitude and if you can't handle customers in a polite and respectful way, then maybe a guy like that should not be in a job where he has to deal with the public. There are lots of suppliers out there who do show appreciation for your custom and make you feel welcome. I know it must be frustrating sometimes for these guys when someone like myself goes into their store and don't know the correct terminology to use but most salespeople I have come across, tolerate this from their customers and help and advise to the best of their ability. It should not be necessary to buy a book and learn the jargon or technical terms of every little item you may need to purchase. You may never need to use those same items again. The salesperson is suppose to be there to help you and in all fairness, I must say, that most of them do just that.
If suppliers have no tolerance toward the general public then they should restrict sales to trade only.

[Ian Wells]

you need to understand

that in doing their job ,

selling you timber, tools,and hardware, etc

as they watch you load all the goodies into your car

and enthusiastically drive off to your next project,:D

they are constantly reminded

that they are selling,

and not making:((

You hit that nail squarely on the head

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Three choices, really:

Avoid going there
Learn the lingo
Put up with it

There's a fourth choice: go in with a sidekick (in full work clobber - you need to look the part) and invent your own lingo. Have a quiet mutter & snigger with your sidekick when the bloke at the desk looks baffled. They'll generally fall over 'emselves to work out what the hell you're on about. :U

My ex-boss (who was a Tradie BTW) used to do this all the time just to wind up the "desk jockeys." :;

[Cliff Rogers]

....My ex-boss (who was a Tradie BTW) used to do this all the time just to wind up the "desk jockeys." :;
Good one. :D

[Eastie]

Did you go to the Reece trade desk .....

[big_gumbo]

I'm a qualified tradie and i got treated badly with one of the guys from bunnings. I still shop there, but what i do now is, 2 items in pocket, 1 item on the counter (2 for me, 1 for them). Walk out the door - "thanks for the freebies Bunnings!"

[Wood Borer]

The clowns behind the counter are morons and the ones who employ them are bigger morons. Most of their tradie mates are also moronic.

Be very glad that you are not part of their very sus tight little circle.:B

[Claw Hama]

The only reason they are counter jockeys is they don't have the brains to get a real job. I am a tradie and I always make sure I am wearing my trade shirt with logo and look the part or you don't get any respect ( get a shirt from someone doesn't matter what trade). Helps if you do your homework first so you know what you are asking for and that they give you the right thing. They often don't know what they are doing or talking about!!

[Ian Smith]

I'm a qualified tradie and i got treated badly with one of the guys from bunnings. I still shop there, but what i do now is, 2 items in pocket, 1 item on the counter (2 for me, 1 for them). Walk out the door - "thanks for the freebies Bunnings!"
So, Big Gumbo, a tradie AND a thief...double jeopardy:((

[Calm]

So, Big Gumbo, a tradie AND a thief...double jeopardy:((

Wonder how honest he is adding up the hours to do your job?? Then again probably not the only one.

[scooter]

I'm a qualified tradie and i got treated badly with one of the guys from bunnings. I still shop there, but what i do now is, 2 items in pocket, 1 item on the counter (2 for me, 1 for them). Walk out the door - "thanks for the freebies Bunnings!"

And people wonder why we ask for receipts, check inside stuff, look in the back of utes, disbelieve dodgy sounding stories, etc etc.

Thieves like you me off mate. Your parents must be proud.


Sean

[Calm]

And people wonder why we ask for receipts, check inside stuff, look in the back of utes, disbelieve dodgy sounding stories, etc etc.

Thieves like you me off mate. Your parents must be proud.


Sean

i agree totally. The prices we pay have theft built into them.

[artme]

I have had great service at Reece in Browns Plains. Don't think poor service is anything other than the attitude of the drongo you have the misfortune to deal with.
Developing a good set of comeback lines at least gives you some satisfaction, even if it doesn't improve the service.

I was in a hardware store once where it was apparrent that I was akin to
an unwelcome bad odour. the store had little of what I wanted anyway. When I was rudely asked if there was anything else hat I wanted help with I said "Yes, I like you to tell me what else you don't have." Got a laugh from a couple of customers.

[manoftalent]

"You mean zinc"
well obviously if gal is not available, zinc will do
"Ummm yeah, that's the one" I reply
"Does it all come as one piece?" I then ask
"It's an offset you want isn't it?" He asks back sharply
well I am not really sure of the terminology, I usually hack up animals for a living, a butcher by trade ....but a bit better than the one that installed my downpipe to begin with ....so an offset is?...
"What's an offset?"
"Well if you have eaves you have to go back towards the house, or do you want it to go straight down to the ground?" He asks me with a bit of tone.
I want it to look as it did before, as I explained to you....it runs back onto the house under the eaves and down the wall into the ground ....do you have that much pipe in stock??...oh and the bracket thingamybobs to hold it on the wall please :U

is this going to take long? I am parked in a two hr zone:~


as you may have guessed the red would have been my responces, whenever I meet someone like this that has no respect for the customer that puts food on HIS table ......then its open season as far as I am concerned .....as a customer I have a right to SERVICE, I am always polite to them and I expect the same in return ....and God help them should they take it into their minds to overstep that boundary ....I DONT BUDGE...and neither should you ...if your not satisfied , stand your ground ...and ask for someone over their head ..... state your case politely and calmly and right there and then ...ask for an appology ....you will get one .......and when you leave you will have satisfaction that this fool is bleeding from the seams because you beat him, and he will without a doubt think twice before irritating you again...

[underfoot]

When I was rudely asked if there was anything else hat I wanted help with I said "Yes, I like you to tell me what else you don't have." Got a laugh from a couple of customers.

hee hee,:D I've got to try that one artme:D

[Wood Borer]

And people wonder why we ask for receipts, check inside stuff, look in the back of utes, disbelieve dodgy sounding stories, etc etc.

Thieves like you me off mate. Your parents must be proud.


Sean

Thanks for treating us like fools Sean - he confessed that he was a tradie, isn't that enough?

The cheating, stealing, lying, not keeping appointments and general low life attitude is naturally assumed.

Most tradies make second hand car dealers look like they have soul.

Apologies to the fair dinkum good tradies who seem to be in the minority, are honest and excellent at their trade as well as nice people.

[RETIRED]

Apologies to the fair dinkum good tradies who seem to be in the minority, are honest and excellent at their trade as well as nice people.Glad you put that in Rob.

Another problem is that certain items of the same sort are known differently in different trades.

[autogenous]

Being a female woodworker I am sometimes treated in a similar manner to how you were treated when I go into hardware stores or timber yards. I always try to know the name of what I am after and find taking a deep breath before I go in to the store helps! If the people are a bit rude or unpleasant I usually dont bother going back unless I have no choice.
He turns without saying anything, gets the bits, dumps the appropriate items on the counter, gives me an invoice, and I pay and leave.Please don't think your the only ones that cop this. Tradies cop the Rock star attitude too. Unfortunately its hard to get people to do these jobs and not all but a few think they're rock and roll stars because they know every name and code.

There is also the handy person who heads into a store and wants half an hours attention to buy a 45 degree connection with $2 margin on it.
Hence some big hardwares just have the gear there and you make your own decisions without half an hours advice on $2.00 margin.

Any rate finishing off a large renovation the other day while the plumber put in the drains. Hes goes to the connections box full of joins, swears, gets on the phone.

"Can you imbeciles not read an order, I spend $100000 with you guys each year and you still cant get it right. How many times are you going to stuff up" (Saturday afternoon) "Get the brain dead knobber in the ute and bring out the connection now or no more $100000"

25 minutes later ute comes flying in with angry staff member and the plumber gives him the stre down. Ute zooms off with angry staff member.

You get attitude with a lot of stores. Some of the bigger hardware store staff run from you into the next isle or send you on a wild goose chase.

Anyone in WA pm me and Ill send you to a smaller hardware/plumbing supply that the "big" project builders have used for years that not many know about.
Their service has been very good for years. They have had problems getting staff like anyone else.

[silentC]

Some of the bigger hardware store staff run from you into the next isleWhat, to New Zealand??!! :)

I've always found our local plumbing supply shop (Swan Plumbing) to be very helpful, knowledgeable and courteous. In fact, if anything they are more polite and helpful to my wife than to me. They always get our business.

Our local hardware is going the way of the big city hardwares - only employing people prepared to work for $12.50 an hour with no particular knowledge or skill other than how to run the cash register. I never feel intimidated when dealing with them, but just try and get a sensible answer to a question out of any of them. I go there less and less.

In a way, I would prefer to go somewhere that is staffed by arrogant wanna-bes than somewhere staffed by housewives and career retailers. At least they might have a clue about what you want. Try talking to the girl down here at Mitre 10 about downpipes and see how far you get.

Note this is no reflection on the staff - it's not their fault that Mitre 10's employment policies focus more on how little you're prepared to take home than on how much you bring to the job.

[Pheonix]

Mostly its because most of you have MUG written large across your forehead.:q

[zacnelson]

I must say, it is a bit of a relief to see that I'm not the only one to get the arrogant treatment from specialist hardware stores. I normally find Bunnings etc to be attitude-free, because their business is primarily DIY etc.

I used to have a full-time home business in Yarraville building road-cases, and the nearest engineering supplies store was Swanson Engineering which were about 10min drive away. Amongst other things, I used to go through thousands of rivets each week, I also needed bulk boxes of washers and bolts and nuts. Swanson mainly supplied trade customers, and had products and bulk quantities you wouldn't find at Bunnings. They were so rude, and ridiculously over-charged me, I felt intimidated walking in, it was like I was an intruder. I used to joke with my wife that as soon as I walk in they might as well say `your money is no good here'.

Then, I discovered a similar engineering supplies store called Warburtons (in Sunshine). It meant an extra 10 minutes further in the car, but they were incredibly friendly and helpful, AND their prices were in some instances half what Swanson charged! I didn't even have to ask for special bulk discount prices either; once they recognised my face and saw me turn up regularly and buy similar supplies, they voluntarily started giving me even cheaper prices - this was within only 3 to 5 visits.

The guys at the local Reece trade desk are incredibly rude and ignorant. Sometimes I think they don't want to make money. I have seen this time and time again in various trade stores, be it for hardware, timber and board suppliers, plastering supplies, paint, concrete, even specialist tool shops.

The thing is, you don't see it in other industries or stores. I used to be heavily involved in the music industry, firstly as your usual hobbyist, then later buying high-end gear for a professional studio. At both stages, no matter how many stores all over Australia I dealt with, staff universally go out of their way to assist and never patronise or look down their nose at customers.

In my experience people in the automotive industry at stores like Repco or Autobahn etc can also be very rude at their trade desks, and realistically they should surely expect a far higher percentage of amateur customers. A lot more home-mechanics buy parts for their cars than you would see people buying downpipes or other hardware beyond the usual DIY stuff.

I could go on with various theories as to why this culture permeates the Australian building/manufacturing industries. Do they think money just grows on trees? Are they at all aware of what is involved in a free market economy? The problem is no doubt more prevalent in the coal-face staff at the counter. Their bosses no doubt understand the need to make money.

I think a lot of them are jaded employees, with little to no education, who didn't perhaps `make the cut' in the related trade (eg plumbing or mechanics) and are relegated to doing a very boring and less well paid career, and like to make themselves feel powerful.

The thing is, they have no idea what skills or knowledge their customer has; sure someone may not know all about plumbing, but how does the wanka at the counter know they're not dealing with someone who is a master concretor or electrician etc? Must everybody be totally fluent in ALL areas to get decent service everywhere?

Some people make the argument that trade stores are protecting plumbers and other tradies who wouldn't be able to make money if everybody else was cutting in on their territory and doing it themselves. That makes me laugh - have you ever tried to get a tradesman to turn up on time? Or to even bother giving you a quote? Or finish a job off properly? It's not easy! So don't tell me they need special protection from their fat buddies at the local trade desk.

I recently had a sparky charge a huge amount for a tiny little job, a couple of really easy power points in rooms with no plaster or floors or ceilings (ie no access difficulty for the roughing) and it took him about 2 months to finish it off; he sent his useless apprentice to do the job, who came over 6 times and each time he nicked off after 45 minutes, he didn't bring the necessary items when he actually did anything (ie didn't bring THE POWER POINTS with him). In one room he installed a ceiling fan where there was a plaster ceiling, and poked four big screwdriver holes through the ceiling in a metre radius from the fan location (he was obviously trying to guess the spot from above so he could go back down and see if he was right) and I'm going to have to patch them up sometime. Heaven knows why he didn't just poke one hole from BELOW??? Then he left the wire loose around the ceiling fan, so within a few weeks we had a loud banging noise because it had fallen in. It wasn't hard for me to go in the roof and fix that, but it was such an unprofessional job, particularly when they're charging something like $160 an installation. He attached the power points after I lined the walls, then when I did the tiling I unscrewed the power point so it would fit over the tiles. Only to discover he hadn't installed them properly, he'd left out the backing plate and just whacked a few screws into villaboard! UNBELIEVABLE!

[chrisp]

This thread reminds me of that "Not the nine o'clock news" sketch ...

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[rrich]

I have encountered that type of attitude on occasion. However, more recently I have found that if you start the conversation with, "Would you help me with this problem?" Attitudes are usually left in the break room.

[peter_sm]

It was a P****Tec Trade outlet.


Did you go to the Reece trade desk .....

[peter_sm]

Interestingly I have been to a plasterboard trade outlet, and they were more than helpful. They supplied me with all the correct stuff.

[rileyp]

Hey Warburtons used to be in South Melbourne and I found them most friendly and extremely helpful!
Where are they now?
Oh and Ive been to Reece in your area and found the same poor treatment as I'm a sparky not a plumber.( I went in their 10 years ago and haven't been back...)
Tradelink or Mcanns in North Geelong both are excellent!
Problem with trade outlets aka Reece is this they sell 1 - 2 million $$ worth of stuff a year to 2 or 3 contractors and anything else is just filling in the time...
They would much rather fill in there time with someone who knows what to order than with some wanna be plumber and they get frustrated easily.
The thing is they can take an order for maybe 50 -60 individual different items over the phone from a tradey that knows what to ask for worth 5-10 grand in the same amount of time they can take your order for 2 lengths of 65mm zinc down pipe with 4X85 degree off sets.
And so they feel they are pissing in the wind so to speak because what happens to them is this.
You buy the stuff you take it home you only use half of it and then you take the rest back for a cash refund and they wish they never met you in the first place.
I'm not in anyway condoning their bad behavior as its just plain rude.I do understand their frustration though.
Its no different to my feeling when they send the wrong stuff to site and I have to call them and say I ordered bends not elbows and I even gave you the part no.!!!!!!!!!!
When I go into trade outlets these days that are not of my trade I go in and announce I'm a Saturday morning customer (better known as idiots day)and ask who would like to help me?
From that point on they are usually pretty good and are happy to help.
If I do go in on Saturday I ask how they managed to draw the short straw and they smile as its idiots day.
I just need the thingmajig that goes on the end of the long thing...
:2tsup: Warburtons is a engineering supplier with excellent staff and support for their customers.They used to be in South Melbourne near the blood bank...
I alway wondered what happened to them as I would gladly pay a little more to get the help they provide as the help you get from bunnies isn't usually the help you generally want as the tradeys they employ are usually pretty crappy... couldn't make a dollar in the trade and so they go work in bunnnies...
When I go into bunnies sometimes I listen to them talk to customers innocently while I choose what I'm after and its sad the ???? they tell them...some times so sad I go get what the customer is after and hand it to them and the bunny tradey goes yeah I just about to suggest that.
Yeah right if you had any real trade experience.
my 2 cents
I'm spent
cheers Rileyp

[Ian Wells]

found this thought it was relevant
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[prozac]

I have to give the staff at REECE PLUMBING in Brookvale (near Manly) full marks for patience, helpfulness and courtesy. I have been doing renos of late and buying lots of copper pipe and fittings, waste pipes and fittings etc. When I don't know the exact name for something they go and fetch a couple of similar items and ask which one I need, and then tell me what it is and if I can get a cheaper one or one that will last longer. I have not had attitude from any of them. To top it off they suggested I open an account and the more I buy the cheaper it gets!

prozac