In need of a debt collector

[Guy]

Hi All
Done some work for someone over a few weeks ( 6 in all) renovating there rental property. Sent her a final invoice 2 weeks ago and she prommised to direct debit my account the following day. Well nothing has been credited nad she does not answer her phone or respond to any emails.
Found out today the other contractors that were there have not been paid either, Have sent her another letter last monday which has been returned " not known at this address" .
So does anyone know any one with a big crowbar and lots of muscals ar a debt collector i can turn to.
Or even some free legal advice as i cant afford a sollicitor and has put me in very difficult position finacially at the moment.

[bsrlee]

Go to your local court & see the clerk or pro bono solicitor - ask at the front counter.

Get the sherrif to serve a small debits summons, then get a court order/judgement for the debit. Get the sherrif to seize the property & sell it to recover the money - before it gets to the selling property stager she should have paid up, unfortunately you probably can't charge for the running around costs (varies from state to state).

In NSW you could have her declared bankrupt with debits of over $500, then sell her up & split the proceeds with the other contractors who are owed.

[Simomatra]

Go to your local court & see the clerk or pro bono solicitor - ask at the front counter.

Get the sherrif to serve a small debits summons, then get a court order/judgement for the debit. Get the sherrif to seize the property & sell it to recover the money - before it gets to the selling property stager she should have paid up, unfortunately you probably can't charge for the running around costs (varies from state to state).

In NSW you could have her declared bankrupt with debits of over $500, then sell her up & split the proceeds with the other contractors who are owed.

Does anybody know what the law about this says in Qld

My son did some printing work for a customer who know refuses to pay. Nothing wrong with the work she just makes a habit apparently of not paying. He has used a debt collector to no avail she just fobs him off. Also refuses to accept registered mail and keeps changing telephone numbers

As for the small claims tribunal they can make judgment apparently but not make the person pay. My son would also have to have time off work to attend court, more money to chase bad money

I think my son would appreciate any help on this matter as well

[bitingmidge]

As for the small claims tribunal they can make judgment apparently but not make the person pay. My son would also have to have time off work to attend court, more money to chase bad money

Sam,

All your answers are on these pages:

http://www.justice.qld.gov.au/courts/factsht/C07SmallClaims.htm

http://www.artslaw.com.au/LegalInformation/DebtRecovery/DebtRecoveryQLD.asp

http://www.legalaid.qld.gov.au/publications/self-help/kits/Small_Claims_Tribunal.htm

Cheers,

P

[Simomatra]

Sam,

All your answers are on these pages:

http://www.justice.qld.gov.au/courts/factsht/C07SmallClaims.htm

http://www.artslaw.com.au/LegalInformation/DebtRecovery/DebtRecoveryQLD.asp

http://www.legalaid.qld.gov.au/publications/self-help/kits/Small_Claims_Tribunal.htm

Cheers,

P

Much appreciated my son will be happy I hope, thanks BM

[ozwinner]

Go here to VCAT (http://www.vcat.vic.gov.au/CA256DBB0022825D/HomePage?ReadForm&1=Home~&2=~&3=~)
I think it costs $30 and they will sort it out, take documentation, pictures etc.
Get the other ppl who are owed money together as it may add weight to your claim.

Al :(

[Guy]

I did a claim a couple years ago through VCAT, it went in my favour however they still did not pay up as VCAT do not have the powers to enforce there own orders.
So i would have had to then goto the magistrate courts and go through it all again.
That time it was for a smaller amount, this time its close to $5000. I had been paid for all the materials used is one blessing but its my labour thats not been paid for.

[boban]

I did a claim a couple years ago through VCAT, it went in my favour however they still did not pay up as VCAT do not have the powers to enforce there own orders.
So i would have had to then goto the magistrate courts and go through it all again.
That time it was for a smaller amount, this time its close to $5000. I had been paid for all the materials used is one blessing but its my labour thats not been paid for.

In NSW the equivalent of VCAT has their orders enforced by the Sheriff just as if it were a Local (Magistrates) Court order. Just check with VCAT as to their enforcement procedures.

Otherwise, I would file a Statement of Claim in the Magistrates Court. The chamber magistrate will be able to help him. For these amounts it does not pay to use a professional as the costs (in NSW) are severely restricted for the successful party.

I've appeared against unrepresented parties as also witnessed them in action. The magistrates go out of their way to help them.

Good luck.

[ozwinner]

Get in touch with Judge Judy.

Al :D

[Grunt]

Send in Al and his goats.

[Waldo]

G'day,

I'm in favour of a more direct approach - a great big heavy lump of 4x2 or otherwise known as "The Enforcer". At least with the way of the toothless tigers that these departments are hamstrung that's how I'd feel anyway. :mad:

[Sturdee]

In NSW the equivalent of VCAT has their orders enforced by the Sheriff just as if it were a Local (Magistrates) Court order. Just check with VCAT as to their enforcement procedures.


The beauty of our federal system is that each state has their own laws regarding debt collection. :rolleyes:

In Vic a debt proven in VCAT and an order made by them must again be proven in the local Magistrate Court/County Court before they can be acted upon. VCAT is a paper tiger in regards to debt collection and is a waste of time. DAMHIK.:(

When you try to prove a VCAT order in the Magistrate court the other party can then dispute the claim and this then will mean a full hearing to adjucate the issue.

Then when succesful you can try to recover same using a debt collection agency (use one that doesn't charge you a fee if unsuccesful) and when finally unsuccesful you can indeed try for bankruptcy proceedings.

At all stages you will need to be precise and accurate making sure that you are indeed claiming from the correct person as they may have been acting in a representative capacity eg director of a company or trustee of a trust rather then for themselves. Don't make the mistake of suing an individual when you should be looking at a company.

Also this may well take some time as justice grinds in a slow fashion and an expert non payer can, without really trying, make the system even slower. In a previous life I was involved in a similar, but reversed, situation were on principle the matter was delayed for 2 years by my boss because he was upset that a supplier sued him rather than wait his normal 2 month for payment.

Also this will require payment to cover costs all along the way. It could work out expensive.

BTW you do have written quotes and agreements specifying the work to be done and in what manner and specifics as regards payment terms etc. else you will have a very hard time to prove that the work was done as agreed.

Good luck.


Peter.

[stevebaby]

Graffiti artists and vandals are a wicked blight on society and probably deserve the penalties that the full weight of the law can throw at them.
Which is probably a fine of $500 for a first offender.
Which does absolutely nothing to compensate the unfortunate property owner who may lose thousands of dollars trying to remove the damage and who may lose thousands more trying to sell a vandalised property and who will probably lose thousands more trying to recover damages.
Some degree of damage is inevitable if someone were to recover their goods left on another property.
Of course the property owner would have equal recourse to the law and an equal chance of recovery of costs.
This should be taken as an emotional response to a similar situation and is in no way an advisory position.

[bitingmidge]

Graffiti artists and vandals are a wicked blight on society and probably deserve the penalties that the full weight of the law can throw at them.

Now there's an interesting hijack Steve? :confused: :confused: :confused:

Unless the person that didn't pay the bill was in fact a Graffiti vandal.

I think it's sad though, that Graffiti "ARTISTS" should be lumped in with Graffiti "VANDALS", if you don't know what I'm talking about check out http://www.banksy.co.uk

I'd be happy for banksy to vandalise my place any day! (and I'd make a quid out of it too I reckon...)

cheers,

P

[Sturdee]

Some degree of damage is inevitable if someone were to recover their goods left on another property.


Totally irrelevent to the discussion as Guy has been paid for the materials used but not for his labour.

BTW anything built on a property attaches to the land and later removal because of nonpayment is theft, notwithstanding that you may not have been paid for the work or the materials.

Again from my experiences in a previous life I know of a subcontractor who erected a frame for a builder (not us :D ) that went into receivership before payment was made to the subcontractor. This subby thought it was okay to remove the frame and then reuse the timber on another job.

Unfortunately for him the receiver didn't agree and made the police prosecute for theft and he sued the subby for the value of the job that he demolished. Again unfortunately for the subby the magistrate agreed with the receiver, found the subby guilty and gave him 6 months and he had to pay the receiver for the damage and after 2 years got 10cents in the dollar back. :mad:

Peter.

[maglite]

As a last resort you could always hire a "dog";)

Apparently, some charge as little as 10% of the gross and have been known to be very effective........or so im told.

[Bob38S]

...
Again from my experiences in a previous life I know of a subcontractor who erected a frame for a builder (not us :D ) that went into receivership before payment was made to the subcontractor. This subby thought it was okay to remove the frame and then reuse the timber on another job.

Unfortunately for him the receiver didn't agree and made the police prosecute for theft and he sued the subby for the value of the job that he demolished. Again unfortunately for the subby the magistrate agreed with the receiver, found the subby guilty and gave him 6 months and he had to pay the receiver for the damage and after 2 years got 10cents in the dollar back. :mad:

Peter.

As per usual - the court system gives you legal procedure not Justice.:mad::mad:
Bob

[keith53]

Totally irrelevent to the discussion as Guy has been paid for the materials used but not for his labour.

BTW anything built on a property attaches to the land and later removal because of nonpayment is theft, notwithstanding that you may not have been paid for the work or the materials.

Again from my experiences in a previous life I know of a subcontractor who erected a frame for a builder (not us :D ) that went into receivership before payment was made to the subcontractor. This subby thought it was okay to remove the frame and then reuse the timber on another job.

Unfortunately for him the receiver didn't agree and made the police prosecute for theft and he sued the subby for the value of the job that he demolished. Again unfortunately for the subby the magistrate agreed with the receiver, found the subby guilty and gave him 6 months and he had to pay the receiver for the damage and after 2 years got 10cents in the dollar back. :mad:

Peter.

I must admit, I'm struggling to see where the fairness is here. Here's a glaring example of a law that needs to be changed quickly.:mad:

[echnidna]

They're experienced in avoiding paying their bills so conventional legal action will cost and while you might "win" you still might not get the money!!

So you have to be a little unorthodox,
And its a battle of legal tactics.
They have assets,
You may be able to place a lien on their property
together with a caveat on title.
As soon as a caveat is placed on title they are notified.
So they are forced to contact lodger of the caveat.
At that time maybe a threat of bankruptcy by your lawyer is sufficient.
But do all of that through a smart lawyer.

Starting bankruptcy proceedings is interesting and legitimate.
As soon as that happens all debtors will swoop in like the hounds from hell.

[Phil Spencer]

Hi All
Done some work for someone over a few weeks ( 6 in all) renovating there rental property. Sent her a final invoice 2 weeks ago and she prommised to direct debit my account the following day. Well nothing has been credited nad she does not answer her phone or respond to any emails.
Found out today the other contractors that were there have not been paid either, Have sent her another letter last monday which has been returned " not known at this address" .
So does anyone know any one with a big crowbar and lots of muscals ar a debt collector i can turn to.
Or even some free legal advice as i cant afford a sollicitor and has put me in very difficult position finacially at the moment.

Hi Guy

You live in Melbourne we use Pruscha foe a small fee they are usually helpful.

Good luck

Phil

[ozwinner]

Hi Guy

You live in Melbourne we use Pruscha foe a small fee they are usually helpful.

Good luck

Phil

Yeah I tryed Prushka a coupla months ago to collect $2000 from a small builder.
They are about as useful as tits on a bull.

Ill just wait awhile to get revenge.

Al :p

[Sturdee]

They have assets, You may be able to place a lien on their property together with a caveat on title.

Bit more complicated than that Bob. Firstly you must satisfy the Registrar of Titles that there is no dispute about the amount claimed and that in fact there is a debt, eg a Court judgment. If the other party advises the Titles office that there is a dispute and there is no court judgment to disprove such claim they will not register it and tell you to obtain a Supreme Court order.



Starting bankruptcy proceedings is interesting and legitimate.
As soon as that happens all creditors will swoop in like the hounds from hell.

The biggest problem with that is that the petitioner creditor has to underwrite the costs of the bankruptcy until the liquidator that is appointed can sell any assets to pay for it. I know of someone who went that path and not only did he not get any money back he had to pay an additional $2000 to pay to have them placed in bankruptcy. Of course the other creditors will swoop but they won't have to pay any of the costs if there is insufficient funds to meet the liquidation.

Again, as remarked, it is a legal system and not a justice system. It ought to be reformed but never will because the fat cats and their mates will have too much to lose.

Peter.

[Bodgy]

I suggest you try to collect the debt yourself, before trying legal means, which would probably cost more than you would get back.

Its unclear from your post as to whether the debtor is renting the property or the owner of the property. Just because the letter was returned 'not known' doesn't mean she still doesn't live there. Its easy to not answer the phone and ignore emails, suggest you front up yourself. This is very uncomfortable for the debtor and usually works - to a greater or lesser extent.

Always assuming that you have the address where she actually lives. If you don't get a result when you front her, make a bit of a fuss. Enough so the neigbours hear. Embarrass the women.

Its worth trying a bit harder, even if you feel uncomfortable with it.

$5K should be strenuously chased.

[black.mac]

I used "Prushka" to collect bad debts from time to time. They usually pester the living daylights out of the bad pay, If that does'nt work they will take the matter to court-which costs a bomb. Probably the old saying still applies pretty well, "A bad compromise is better than a good law suit."

[Guy]

Had an email from this F^&*(ng woman and claims that my invoice is outragous and she claims she has spoken to me about it many times, she also claims the works were not completed to her satisfaction.

I met with her 3 weeks ago and she pointed out 2 areas where paint needed to be touched up, this was done tha following day. She also requested that i get the locks changed which i did the day the carpet people were there, as i told her i needed 2 hours to get the locks rekeyed.
The following day she had someone else come in and rekeyed them again.
She does not repond to my calls and email.

She advised that she has engaged someone else to do all the stuff she wants done that i supposedly did not do. (quoted but not authorised to proceed)
I worked from her schedule of what she wanted doing and quoted accordingly against that, she changed her mind on 1 item but i decided to do the work as it would not have been any greater cost to me.

She says she wil pay minus the $4000 she claims the other guy wants to fix the items i did not quote for.

I have contacted Chartered Mechantile whom charge around 6% if they are succesful, there rates seem fare as long as she does pay up.
My solicitor is contacting her tomorrow and has advised that as she has been using her companies email to send any communications and gave me the authorisation to proceed with work. I will be able to claim the debts through her business (she owns the business), even though she own the property directly.

It is also easier to place a default listing against her company, which will be instigated tomorrow.

I have every thing is in black and white and i have copies of all communictions whether by email or SMS. I always confirmed the changes she wanted and quoted accordingly. As i did not get a responce to the variation quotes i sent here i did not undertake the work as i had not been authorised to do so.
My previous job was a project manager dealing with builders all the time.

I will keep you informed, but it doesnt help me as all i have is 60c in the bank and am totally screwed as i have bills to pay like everyone else here.

Guy

[Gaza]

Fing bitch,

so over people like this, i too are in same boat got one company that i suby to for 2 months owes me around 3k, stop working them 2 weeks ago still no cash but its better to sit at home than go to work for free.

I have started Security of payment action against them, the idea is to have a ruling from adjudicator within 3 weeks then can enforce the ruling through court.

Any one know where you can work and get paid every week let me know, maybe its the building industry.