Food safe oil - polish?

[rtyuiop]

Hi folks,

Anyone have any thoughts on whether a serving board (huon pine and blackwood) would benefit from a hit with a polisher after applying some of our esteemed leader's food safe oil (mineral oil)?

I am hoping for a glossier finish than a cutting board would normally get, as the surface shouldn't get chopped up - just planning to use it for a platter, keeping greasy takeaway containers off the table!

Cheers,

Danny

[soundman]

The other option is hard shelac ...... shelac is THE original food safe finish ...... was at one time used to cote tablets for medication.

cheers

[WhatMomKnows]

Hi folks,

Anyone have any thoughts on whether a serving board (huon pine and blackwood) would benefit from a hit with a polisher after applying some of our esteemed leader's food safe oil (mineral oil)?

I am hoping for a glossier finish than a cutting board would normally get, as the surface shouldn't get chopped up - just planning to use it for a platter, keeping greasy takeaway containers off the table!

Cheers,

Danny
Hi Danny, This is my FIRST Post here on this forum. So lets see if I do this right :-)
Anyhoo, I have come from a world the last couple of years, where Mineral Oil is not a safe item to be using. Let me explain. The last couple of years I dove head in, to the Bath and Body works side of the sun. Making all kinds of Soaps, Lotions, Scrubs and more. Hanging out with Essential oils, and oils of all kinds to create SAFE For Skin Items. One of the biggest things I came across in this world of bath products, is that Mineral Oil was NOT to be used and was a NO NO. This is mainly because it is a Petroleum By Product. And so, let me add, that I am a NEWER Woodworker, but for me, the same rule would apply here. If I would NOT put Mineral oil on my Skin or use it for any Safe for Skin products, I would NOT want to place this on my cutting board where my food will come in contact with it. I have been working on using the information I got from the Bath and Body world and have brought it over to the wood working world. I think a person could find safer things to use on a cutting Board, other than a petroleum by product such as Mineral Oil. Just my 2 cents. I hope to showcase a Video on my YouTube channel within the next couple of weeks, that will feature a DIY Finish Conditioner for Food Safe wood items such as Cutting Boards and for me, a Potato Bin. I am totally open to positive feedback. I have been researching things like Lanolin in a combination of possibly Coconut Oil, Walnut Oil, Bee Wax, Lemon Essential Oil, Vitamin E Oil and Rosemary Oil. A Combination that will not go rancid and will be durable enough to condition the wood and making it water repellent. I am still tweaking this and like I said, I hope to make a video soon. So yes, anyone with any additional help or advice, a am more than open to it. And Thank you!! I hope Danny, that maybe I have helped you? I also hope you have the BEST Week Ever!!! If I have not helped, my apologies, as I have tried :-)
I do know that this does not help your original question and only directly talks about the Mineral Oil part of the conversation within your question. As far as answering your exact question, I do not have an answer to that. I wanted to share with you what I have been learning about Mineral Oil, is all. Again, I hope I helped, at least in part.
WhatMomKnows
YouTube Channel: Know What Mom Knows

[rtyuiop]

Thanks for your input WhatMomKnows - can you tell us specifically what health issues the bath and body folks see from using mineral oil? I am not aware of any substantive evidence it is a problem.

[BobL]

Why so much angst over food safe finishes?

Any sort of half reasonable risk assessment would show that folks should be far more concerned about food storage and management, the cleanliness of cooking and serving equipment and preparation surfaces, and what is in the food they're eating, rather than the finishes that go on platters and chopping/cutting boards.

In Australia

Food poisoning results, on average, in 5.4 million cases a year (including 120 deaths), 1.2 million visits to doctors, 300,000 prescriptions for antibiotics, and 2.1 million days of lost work each year.
See http://www.australasianscience.com.au/article/issue-december-2012/tis-season-get-food-poisoning.html

[rtyuiop]

I guess (personally) I think of them as two separate issues Bob. I still try to avoid losing a finger in a horrifying blender accident, despite it probably - admittedly I'm only guessing - being more likely I'll cut one off with a bandsaw!

[BobL]

I guess (personally) I think of them as two separate issues Bob. I still try to avoid losing a finger in a horrifying blender accident, despite it probably - admittedly I'm only guessing - being more likely I'll cut one off with a bandsaw!

Given that wood is natural antibiotic with raw wood outperforming virtually all other materials in terms of suppressing bug growth, any illnesses due to wood toxicity combined with the tiny amount likely to be ingested of the wood through use as a serving or cutting board is almost certainly going to be outweighed by its antibiotic property.

Covering up the wood with a finish will reduce its antibiotic property.
Perhaps fortunately for us almost all finishes don't last long if the wooden item is properly washed.

It appears the best thing you can do is use no finish.

[ian]

Why so much angst over food safe finishes?

Any sort of half reasonable risk assessment would show that folks should be far more concerned about food storage and management, the cleanliness of cooking and serving equipment and preparation surfaces, and what is in the food they're eating, rather than the finishes that go on platters and chopping/cutting boards.
Because (my emphasis)

One of the biggest things I came across in this world of bath products, is that Mineral Oil was NOT to be used and was a NO NO. This is mainly because it is a Petroleum By Product.
and therefore it's not natural, nor organic nor clean and green -- all positive attributes in the world of bath products

[soundman]

When we talk about food safety and general body contact safety ..... we are talking about proven facts and actual reality...... not vage touchy feely natural product hokus pokus.

Clean white mineral oil ( parafin oil) is pretty much inert and inocuous ..... there are many so called "natural" products that are far less healty and suitable for food and bodily contact.

The term " mineral oil" is actually quite misleading ...... unless you believe the conspiracy theorists, so called mineral oil is derived from animal and plant life, it does not come from minerals at all.

There are a number of products that have been proven over many decades, both in practice and by proper scientific testing to be food safe ....... Properly "food safe parafin oil and wax" are just that .... a product that has been specifically manufactured for the food industry ...... both are clean, white ( or clear), pretty much tasteless and non reactive.

The hippies and greenies that want to buy " natural products" simply have a bias against anything man made or mineral, bassed on belief and not facts.

Our esteemed benifcator has done extensive research into the matter ...... look at as many so called natural products ..... there are very few that will stand up to being food safe long term on cutting boards and utensils and most will not come close to comparing with clean white mineral oil intended for the food industry.

look at all those various oils and ingredients in lotions and potions ...... see how many of them you can buy( anywhere anyhow) that are certified food safe and are guaranteed not to taint the food opr degrade and either produce bacterior or harbour it.

cheers

[WhatMomKnows]

Thanks for your input WhatMomKnows - can you tell us specifically what health issues the bath and body folks see from using mineral oil? I am not aware of any substantive evidence it is a problem.

Thank You for your Question! I will first add that I am not a leader in any actual and real knowledge or of any personal scientific experimentation that has to deal with Mineral oil. I will however state that on just about every cosmetic forum I have ever been on, the topic of Mineral Oil has not been a happy topic and has been a disputed one both for the good and the bad that comes by using Mineral Oil. It would seem that the bottom line for me, unless somebody can show me otherwise, that because it is a byproduct of the petroleum process, I would just rather make a better choice for what goes onto my skin and onto my wood projects that will come in contact with food.

About Bobl Statement:
I understand BobL, but I do think that his comment, even tho a good one, is still a separate issue. We could talk all day about food storage and preparation, I am Also a Professional Chef, retired now due to the fact I became Paralyzed in 2012 from an accident, but I believe that could be a conversation for its own topic. I would gladly participate on that topic as well. I too have considered having naked wood, it sure was a thought. But, for me, I have concluded that due to the fact that the wood could possibly break down due to the moisture of the potatoes I would be placing in my Potato Bin, I wanted to protect the wood. I would feel the same way about cutting boards too. Naked would be fine, nothing wrong with that, but I feel that their is also nothing wrong with a little protection of the project with an all natural oil or combination of oils. But good Comment Bob, overall, I enjoyed your read very much :-)

About Soundman Statement:
Hi Soundman, I am not a greenie or a Hippie (although I do love those cool shirts with all the swirly colors) I am not a Tree Hugger either. I consider myself simply a person who likes to make her food from scratch and when I make wood projects, I like to use oils that are well, not a by product of the gasoline industry. I have not facts to back anything up. You got me, and I will admit that you are totally right that thier IS allot of hokie pokie weirdo stuff out their floating around on the internet. But for me, I must am more sensible and down to earth. If an oil comes from a Tree, bush or nut....I like that. If an oil is created as a by product of some chemical process....ya, not really liking that. So for me, When possible, and I do mean that cause its not always possible, but when possible, I like to use what is considered natural. NOT that it is natural...but more that it is considered natural.

Here is my end of the day thought on this subject of mineral oil. Its not that what you use is any better or worse than what I want to use, I just feel that it might be the RIGHT option for ME. I have given the option to use a natural plant or nut oil based on that fact that I can put this on my skin. I do know that SOME would put mineral oil on the skin. I do not for the reasons talked about here. If my excerpts and following article links can help somebody, great. For me, I have always been more of a DIRer than a Buy it in a Box...er....he he. Nothing wrong with a cake mix that comes from a box...but for me, if I can make a cake without all the additives and chemicals that come in many box cake mixes....I am all in. So, will I eat a cake that somebody made from a box? Yes...and will I eat a sandwich that was made on somebody's cutting board that they coated in Mineral oil? Yes
I am not an extremest, I just look at things and look for the better more natural way to accomplish the same thing that others would do.

Here is a quick Excerpt from an article I found:

"In lay terms, that means that these scientists are concerned that much of the mineral oil we are exposed to on a daily basis does contain contaminants that could affect our health. They’re also stating that this topic has not been sufficiently studied to really put our minds at ease."

The following page LIGHTLY Goes over the topic, and gives 3 key reasons to Avoid Mineral Oil. I can find other sources that back this up, if need be as well:
http://www.drfranklipman.com/3-key-reasons-to-avoid-mineral-oil/

Here is another Excerpt from another sourse:
"Besides clogging your pores, blocking toxic elimination through the skin, and hindering skin cell rejuvenation, all mineral oil derivative can be contaminated with cancer causing PAH’s (Polycyclic Aromatic Hydrocarbons). Motor oil is now labeled in California as a carcinogen, and they warn against any skin contact. Mineral oil comes from the same crude oil source."

Here is the link for that excerpt: http://www.oilsofyouth.com/dangers-of-mineral-oil-in-cosmetics/

One More Excerpt...
"Results of scientific research on mineral oil side effects

The workers in chemical, petrochemical, machine-building, metallurgic and car industries, who are exposed to mineral oil through skin contact and breathing, are significantly more frequently diagnosed with skin cancer.
An study on 140 women, giving birth by cesarean, shows that mineral oil accumulates in the body over time. The study linked the build up of mineral oil in body tissue to (amongst others) frequent use of sun creams, lipstick and hand creams."

I found that excerpt here: http://www.naturallyorganicskincare.com/mineral-oil-side-effects/

Now, I understand that NONE of the excerpts listed can be identified as proof. I can not say that their is proof EITHER Way good or bad. But what I can say, is that for me, their is enuf negative talk surrounding Mineral Oil, that I have decided as a NEW Wood worker, I do not want to use it on my safe for food wooden projects such as potato bins and or butcher blocks. Does that mean if you do, that I think you are wrong? Nah...I just think that to each person they need to find what works for them. For ME, I do believe I have found a better way than Mineral Oil. Thank you ALL for your comments. I appreciate them greatly!! Any more? I am loving the conversation on this topic and yes, I am Subject to change my mind on this issue, if somebody can prove otherwise. Thanks

[Evanism]

This is what I use for chopping boards: http://foodgradeoils.com.au/product/food-grade-mineral-oil/

$44 for 5L and $129 for 20L

On the page it blubs about FDA 21 CFR 172.878 which says this https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFRSearch.cfm?fr=172.878 and http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFRSearch.cfm?fr=178.3620

I'm not a scientist and haven't read these dense texts. But it does say quite clearly it is safe and considered safe to use for food items.

Its soaked in a massive plastic tub for 24 hours then left to drip dry on their side. It has fabulous hydrophobic qualities and repels stains pretty much permanently. A quick wipe with a little bottle of it once a week keeps the board looking nice.

Regarding above, the post says "Motor oil is now labeled in California as a carcinogen, and they warn against any skin contact. Mineral oil comes from the same crude oil source." I happen to know this means USED motor oil. As for "Mineral oil comes from the same crude oil source" so does an absolutely astounding number of products we eat, use, bathe in and apply. Crude oil derivatives have seemingly unlimited applications.

Interesting topic.

addendum/edit: to reduce my ignorance further I had a hunt around. Other than quite a few alarmist crackpots and mummy-bloggers there isn't too much general info (real) that isn't scientific in nature. I did however find this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mineral_oil#Food_preparation

[ian]

and I'm waiting for a statement / comment along the lines that natural turpentine is "good" and Mineral turpentine being a product of the petroleum industry is "bad"

[artme]

A little bit of a red herring, but still related to the topic.

The terms "natural'' and ''örganic" are taken by many to imply that that the product is safe or, at the very least "better".

This is patently codswallop!!:q:q

[WhatMomKnows]

This is what I use for chopping boards: http://foodgradeoils.com.au/product/food-grade-mineral-oil/

$44 for 5L and $129 for 20L

On the page it blubs about FDA 21 CFR 172.878 which says this https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFRSearch.cfm?fr=172.878 and http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFRSearch.cfm?fr=178.3620

I'm not a scientist and haven't read these dense texts. But it does say quite clearly it is safe and considered safe to use for food items.

Its soaked in a massive plastic tub for 24 hours then left to drip dry on their side. It has fabulous hydrophobic qualities and repels stains pretty much permanently. A quick wipe with a little bottle of it once a week keeps the board looking nice.

Regarding above, the post says "Motor oil is now labeled in California as a carcinogen, and they warn against any skin contact. Mineral oil comes from the same crude oil source." I happen to know this means USED motor oil. As for "Mineral oil comes from the same crude oil source" so does an absolutely astounding number of products we eat, use, bathe in and apply. Crude oil derivatives have seemingly unlimited applications.

Interesting topic.

addendum/edit: to reduce my ignorance further I had a hunt around. Other than quite a few alarmist crackpots and mummy-bloggers there isn't too much general info (real) that isn't scientific in nature. I did however find this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mineral_oil#Food_preparation



Super Great Information Evanism!!
I DO believe you have opened a much broader look into Mineral Oil than I have ever found on the topic, and I thank you for that! I did look at your links and I will be doing a video on a natural wood conditioner this week for my Show on YouTube ~Know What Mom Knows, and after reading what you have said along with the others here, I do believe that I WILL be changing some of my original wording on the subject. Yes, I believe that this has been a great conversation. Now, do I still intend to choose a more natural approach to conditioning my wooden projects that will come in contact with food? Yes, and NOT because Mineral is not safe to use, cause infact I have now read so much information on the topic to show that it is infact safe for food, but I will be using a more natural approach due to the other many choices of oils that I have at my disposal to use. I still do think that Mineral Oil is an oil that is a by product, but I no longer will be saying that it is LESS safe to be using due to the fact that right now it would seem as if I have more conclusive information that mineral oil is a product that is considered safe. So, when I do my video I will be stating that my choice to use a more natural approach does not at all mean to imply that Mineral oil or other type manufactured oils are any less effective for doing the same thing, just different. Yes, from what I have read today, it would seem that the bottom line is now that Mineral oil is a safe product and not any less safe or more dangerous than if I used a natural product. Just a different approach. Thank you for bringing this information forward, it was truly helpful indeed :-)
Yes, many soapers on the forums I have been on WOULD say that Mineral oil is still not the best choice. I would agree with them on that point but NOT on the point that mineral oil is dangerous. If I have OTHER choices like Coconut Oil and bee wax, yes, I would rather stick with that. But now, I would agree that with this new information that I have just read, their is no reason for me to think of Mineral Oil as Dangerous. Also, I understand that my terms of Natural or Organic here for ME, will mean something that is grown from the earth or lived on the earth....meaning, I know a Coconut is grown here and I know that Bees Live here....Therefore, I would choose Coconut oil and BeeWax first over something that was manufactured here or is a byproduct of a chemical process. But ya, after what I have read here today, I am NOT saying that these items are Better than Mineral Oil...just different. I say that now because the information that has been provided to me now, has shown that mineral oil is safe, and is safe enough to be used in many applications from food production, to the items made to be used in our homes, to transportation and to cosmetics and more. I need to conclude this because for now, I do not see any hard science to tell me otherwise. My thought on this may change ofcourse, if new information on the topic will tell me otherwise. And yes, it is TRUE that many of the MOMMY Forums will jump to the quick conclusion that Mineral Oil is bad....and I think mainly due to the fact that it is based on being a byproduct of the Petroleum industry. But THIS Mommy, ya, I think now has a new conclusion on the matter.
Thank you for highlighting those articles Eanism...and I appreciate all the other comments on the subject. This has been really good for me to read and I thank everyone for taking the time to place such wonderful input here.
I appreciate that and all of you greatly.:) I really am looking forward to finishing up my video now with this great information that has come to light. I am sure many of my Mommy Friends and Soaping/Cosmetic Friends will have a NEW take on some information that has been flying around the forums the last few years. Will they listen? I do not know. But ya, I do see the others side of things a little bit more clearer now and I appreciate that.

[AngelaPetruzzi]

The amount of green wash out in the marketplace makes it hard for one to distinguish what is the 'best" product for their use. One can only read and investigate and take the best info as they understand it. "natural" products are not always as safe as one would think and typically petroleum based products require more manufacturing and additives to make them safe.
Why would one want to use "food safe" finishes on timber? A lot has to do with where the product will be used.

If you are making it for yourself and for home use is one thing BUT if it is being sold or used in commercial aspects, then often some sort of "certification" is required.

Funnily enough, there is no Australian standard for food safety for coatings on chopping boards (used in a supermarkets deli department) however due to the certification of food safety from Germany and a full ingredient disclosure the Livos Kunos range have been accepted.
It all comes down to were it will be used...this will dictate your options.

[Evanism]

I spent a little more time to read the issues about it after these posts.

BobL is correct in pointing out that this is incidental contamination of food and that there are 100 other ways to die other than bulk ingestion from your chicken absorbing trace quantities off your chopping board. :)

I also thought about what was meant by "safe". Would I use it on my face every day? No. Dip my hands into it repeatedly daily as part of a job... no. I wouldn't eat it, but there are foods that are made with it such as "glossy" candies (its how it looks glossy apparently). We must also remind ourselves this isn't 1945 where uranium toothpaste, spraying kids with DDT and lead-based makeup was all the rage: http://nymag.com/thecut/2013/12/most-dangerous-beauty-through-the-ages.html .... we seem to know a bit more about things now. :)

Thinking about the nature of oils - mineral, avocado, nut, olive etc, they are all essentially the same thing. Hydrocarbons. What difference is one hydro over another? (Im asking as a question, as I don't know) One of the serious things to think about is that mineral oil is utterly inert. Nothing can grow in it. Not bacteria, viruses, fungus, nothing. When its made, it is heated and purified in an precise industrial process. Id imagine the end product is about as pure, clean and chemically homogeneous as you can get.

Comparing this with oils obtained from smaller organic or home processes are going to leave a product that isn't so... industrial. The olive oil will have Certain Beasties squashed in as part of the crushing, the nut and fruit oils will have other impurities. When I read about what to treat chop boards with, it was these impurities that create rancidity and other unwanted side effects. Being a food product it will decompose. Part of the board-soaking process injects these into the timber.....

But the chopping boards had me really stumped for ages. A kitchen store had me make an array of cutting boards, about 30 all up (it didn't "work out" with them. They were too hard to satisfy) and it was a real quandary what to finish them with. They needed something other than a very good polish sanding. I was watching a Russian dude who has a Youtube chanel (MTM woodworking http://mtmwood.com/ ) and he soaks his in a bath which I've since replicated https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2t8jXV3fNI . His videos are seriously impressive to watch on a dreary afternoon: https://www.youtube.com/user/mtmwood/

[WhatMomKnows]

Thanks Evanism for the links...I even went and watched th video over at mtmwood.com....I appreciate your information. It looks like he soaks purely in mineral oil. wow! I will still be using my MIX of oils that I have already bought. But now I will look at Mineral oil with in a new light. I like when my eyes get opened like that....pretty cool indeed. Oh, and yes, MY wood projects are for HOME Use Only....at least for now. I live in the USA

[Evanism]

Whatmumknows, I was thinking about your potato bin. You might be better off with nitrocellulose. Its sprayed on. Its 100% natural - it's made by dissolving cotton in nitric acid.

It dries fast, clear, silky smooth, solid, is impreable and its water, oil and most things proof. It is also amazingly easy to apply.

[Robson Valley]

Give me the molecular structures for every one of the so-called "mineral oils" that everybody has mentioned so far. Next, let's sit down to understand what humans can digest, what they can pass and what interferes with the most mundane of human biochemical processes.

Relax. Can you show me the LD50 for mineral oil for humans? I think not.
Who cares? Use olive oil. Be happy. Have another glass of vino.

All other claims are ludicrous. Most are simple threats such as the claim that mineral oil is bad because it is contaminated. Contaminated with what? Plutonium?
I remind you that SubWay uses a plasticizer in their bun dough which is common in flexible plastics.

[TongueTied]

Has anyone come across Ecowood Oil. I got some at a little shop in Maleny but it seems to be available at Masters. It claims to be food safe and made from nut oils and citrus.

[ian]

I believe Ecowood Oil is made in Germany.

[WhatMomKnows]

Thank you for that information....REALLY....wow, I will study your information In the daytime....thanks. I think I am set for THIS project already, but it doesn't mean that I will not discount your information. I can use it on ANOTHER project...We make stuff every week!! Thanks so much Evanism

[WhatMomKnows]

You have Vino? Pass me a Glass!! Ya. I understand that many of the food we get is already contaminated....I DO have a NEW thought on Mineral oil after reading this lovely thread. I still like my coconut oil, olive oil, bee wax and more...but NOW I understand that Mineral Oil...is OK Too :-)
Now where is my glass! :-)

[BobL]

I've always wanted to make a cutting board out of an old whiskey barrel - that way any food I cut up on it would be whiskey flavoured.

An alternative might be to run a plane over the whiskey barrel wood and use the shavings to infuse olive oil - you know like the truffle oil.

If you want an oil that really sticks to wood (or anything for that matter) like a dunny bowl klingon then try chainsaw bar oil.
A few weeks ago I put a large chainsaw into the back of my van and the oil tank lid was not screwed down all the way so that it came open and a half litre or so of bar oil covered about 1/4 of the large rubber mat in the back of the van. This has happened several times before and my solution has been to throw a couple of buckets of fine sawdust into the back and work it back and forth with a broom. A few hours later I would park the van facing uphill and hose the back out. This not being deemed kosher by our local council I decided to try and wipe it up using toilet paper - 3 rolls later there was still oil on the rubber matting.

[soundman]

Back to this greewash notion of "mineral oil"
The process of refineing and seperating various products from crude or recycled oil is possibly one of THE most sofisticated industrial processes we have.

There is a staggering wide array of products derived ...... to associate claims and properties from one product with another that may seem similar is totally erronious.

The clean white mineral oil that is considered "Food Grade", even that which is not is vastly different from engine oil.

This Parafin oil... food grade or not..... is possibly one of the purest and chemically narrow products to come out of the oil processing system...... possibly one of the most chemically narrow products known to man.

They take crude or recycled oils and seperate a wide range of "fractions" from that very complex raw material and produce everything from tar to avation fuel ...... the end products are so wildly different from each other they must be considered completely unrelated ....... the fact that they came out of the ground mixed up as a soup is pretty much irrelivent.

Like making a food type soup where the water is as different to the meat, spices or cabbage as it is possible to be ..... the same can be said of the products that come out of crude oil.

Engine oil ..... which prudently should be considered a semi-toxic chemical in all its states, contains all sorts of chemicals and additives many of them not oil derived including heavy metals... even the base oil is still a fairly chemically complex product.

Parafin oil and parafin wax .... food grade or otherwise are peculear in their purity and chemical narrowness ....... this is necessary to achieve their colourless, odourless, tasteless nature ...... remember the human senses are capable or detecting very very small amounts of aromatic products ...... everybody involved at a modest level in the food industry knows how much very small concentrations of things in food can vary the taste and smell.

One thing that the greeies, hippies, health nuts and conspiracy theorists are realy good at is drawing unhelpfull conclusions, by associating irrelivent facts with a similar but not directly related thing or activity.

This causes problems right from bottled water thru to vaxination, cancer concepts and global warming.

TOO often this results in the overstating on one very low level risk at the cost of another far more present and frequent risk.

THE #1 thing that should be considered when thinking about cutting boards is the suitability of the timber used ..... there are many toxins and tainting products in various timbers .... I am concerned when I hear or see certain timbers used as cutting boards.

ther are timbers that have been known for their suitablity for food contact and others thet are very much illadvised.

Hoop pine for instance is the gold standard for food contact timbers .... which gives rise to one of it's alternative names " butter box pine" ..... it was specifically favoured because it did not taint or stain the butter it was uesd to contain.

I have seen and heard of Camphor Laurel used as cutting and food serving boards ...... I scratch my head ...... this is a product known to contain a toxic aromatic, that while it may not poison you, certainly would taint food left in contact, particularly on fairly fresh timber.

cheers

[Enfield Guy]

On Camphor Laurel, there are those who quote "university tests" that show low bacteria levels on Camphor boards compared to glass, plastic etc, but no other timber. Some makers then use this study to purport that Camphor boards are the best when in fact there has been no like for like testing against other timbers. Result = the consumer/purchaser is mislead.

[Robson Valley]

Vegetable oil biochemistry changes with the number of carbon atoms in the fatty acid side chains. And, the number of double bonds between the carbons.
Those chains are 12 - 20 C long with C16 and C18 being the most common. Rarely saturated (all single bonds) there are one, two, sometimes 3 and rarely 4 double bonds
in each carbon atom chain. By contrast, animal fats are normally straight chains of carbons with single bonds.

[turpene]

If the greenies are keen on natural products, maybe the health food crowd would pay more for an MCT (medium chain triglyceride) oil finished cutting board. Coconut and palm kernel are the most common sources, but using palm kernel oil might upset the sustainability crowd. MCTs have 6-12 carbon atoms in the chain.

Though I hadn't considered it before I have some coconut and avocado oil, might give it a test run on some offcuts.

[Robson Valley]

Research all the veg oils and pick the one you like. Flavorless, tasteless, non-aromatic suggests it's quite pure (many are not).
Put the cutting board in a sheet pan.
Heat the oil to no more than 350F, 325F is a lot better.
Using a silicone basting brush, really slop it on.
You're using Charles' Law in gas physics to enable further penetration as the board & oil cools.

[ubeaut]

Lets get back to the original question....


hi folks,

anyone have any thoughts on whether a serving board (huon pine and blackwood) would benefit from a hit with a polisher after applying some of our esteemed leader's food safe oil (mineral oil)?

I am hoping for a glossier finish than a cutting board would normally get, as the surface shouldn't get chopped up - just planning to use it for a platter, keeping greasy takeaway containers off the table!

Cheers,

danny

Hello Danny (if you're still there after all the above)

Buffing won't help. The idea of the oil is to penetrate the surface of the timber and protect it from water, food smells, contamination, etc.

If you want a brighter shine for use as a serving board rather than a cutting board then you could use Aussie Oil. This is being used for serving and cutting boards that are being sent to Japan and I believe it's been trialled for use on the serving boards in The Scottish McHamburger joints.

There is no reason why the Aussie Oil can't be used over the FoodSafe Plus.

If the platter is to be turned the Aussie oil is fantastic as a Friction Polish.

Hope this is of some help.

Cheers - Neil :U
__________________________________________

As an aside, to add to all the above about mineral oil.

Our FoodSafe Plus is heavy pharmaceutical/medical grade Parrafin oil.

We go to extreme lengths to make sure it is uncontaminated. Even knocked back some from one supplier because it had been decanted into 200lt drums from a 1000lt container which meant it was no longer foodsafe.


Lanolin in a combination of possibly Coconut Oil, Walnut Oil, Bee Wax, Lemon Essential Oil, Vitamin E Oil and Rosemary Oil.

Lanolin - Toxic if ingested.
Coconut oil - Not sure that it's the right thing to be using on wood.
Walnot oil - Great for the multitude of people suffering from nut allergies.
Bees Wax - Good stuff but doesn't take too well to heat.
Lemon Essential Oil - Sure but ordinary lemon oil would be much cheaper and do the same job as would lemon essence and D'Limonene which is already in use by a growing number of polish manufacturers.... Not U-Beaut.
Vitamin E Oil - Of no use to the person using the board or the board unless it is suffering from bad complexion.
Rosemary Oil - Rosemary and Lemon oils may taint any food that is prepared on a board and make your board grow a really good head of hair.

I am not trying to put down you or your ideas. More power to you for trying to have a go at something new and different. However....

If you are going to go down this route you might just well apply some hand cream or moisturiser to your woodwork. Won't work but sure will smell good.

Applications for timber are not the same as applications for skin or essences, etc for internal health. By all means if this is what you want to do, go for it but please don't put ideas into the heads of others that what you are using may be better when clearly they are now.

As for things derived from petrol. You might want to bear in mind that most of the products you mention are stored and sold in plastics derived from petrochemicals unless they are in glass.

:U

[Drillit]

This is what I use for chopping boards: Food Grade Mineral Oil | Stella Food Grade Oils (http://foodgradeoils.com.au/product/food-grade-mineral-oil/)

$44 for 5L and $129 for 20L

On the page it blubs about FDA 21 CFR 172.878 which says this https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFRSearch.cfm?fr=172.878 and CFR - Code of Federal Regulations Title 21 (http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFRSearch.cfm?fr=178.3620)

I'm not a scientist and haven't read these dense texts. But it does say quite clearly it is safe and considered safe to use for food items.

Its soaked in a massive plastic tub for 24 hours then left to drip dry on their side. It has fabulous hydrophobic qualities and repels stains pretty much permanently. A quick wipe with a little bottle of it once a week keeps the board looking nice.

Regarding above, the post says "Motor oil is now labeled in California as a carcinogen, and they warn against any skin contact. Mineral oil comes from the same crude oil source." I happen to know this means USED motor oil. As for "Mineral oil comes from the same crude oil source" so does an absolutely astounding number of products we eat, use, bathe in and apply. Crude oil derivatives have seemingly unlimited applications.

Interesting topic.

addendum/edit: to reduce my ignorance further I had a hunt around. Other than quite a few alarmist crackpots and mummy-bloggers there isn't too much general info (real) that isn't scientific in nature. I did however find this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mineral_oil#Food_preparation
Hello Evanism,
I tend to agree. I use hospital grade paraffin from the Chemist and have never heard of it being unsafe. Furthermore, it is ingested by humans for medical problems, e.g constipation. Anyways interesting discussion. Drillit.

[Pagie]

Asbestos is a natural product.

[Robson Valley]

Asbestos and uranium are both natural and certainly not food safe finishes.

MinWax Tung Oil Protective Finish is food-safe, after the stuff had set up and polymerized.
Read the labels.
I use TOPF on all the dishes that I carve, hardwoods and soft woods.
4 coats is water-wet shiny-smooth for easy cleaning, too.

[Xanthorrhoeas]

The food-safe finish question is a Phoenix topic. It rises from the ashes, flys high and crashes, over and over. Perhaps the moderator could make a sticky for it? I think others have suggested this in the past.

[Xanthorrhoeas]

I use TOPF on all the dishes that I carve, hardwoods and soft woods.
4 coats is water-wet shiny-smooth for easy cleaning, too.

Hi RV, does that mean that you have abandoned your heating technique?

David

[Fumbler]

Wow, I wasn't going to comment but can't help myself. Ihope the next time someone asks this same question, which I guarantee will be asked within 3 months, I hope we don't get 16tonnes of biological warfare from the leftist camps.

[Robson Valley]

Oh but the left handed people are working in their right minds! You're loading 16 tons of #9.

The oven baking seems to work best for smallish wood pieces. The biggest piece I ever did was a birch dish, 1" x 5" x 14" to hold wet things beside the kitchen sink.
I painted that one with beeswax. Wound up with 3 heat treatments to get the wood hot enough to generate air bubbles in the melted wax. What a mess.

All other dishes were carved more as just wood carvings that got a finish just in case somebody needed a platter for sandwiches.
I've used birch, western red cedar (top quality fencepost) and a glue up of Yellow Cedar.
MinWax Tung Oil Protective Finish lends itself to the appearances that I was looking for.