coffee table finish

[sosman]

I have been reading through several of the threads here before joining, looking for some tips on finishing a woodwork project I have just built: http://brewiki.org/pics/tabletop.jpg

Let me get the excuses out the way, I am no expert at woodwork nor photography. I really only noticed the contrast in one strip on the top after the photo shoot. And ok there are a few gaps. The nail hole came with the decking.

It looks like a bar stool but is actually supposed to be a coffee table to go between two recliners (me getting old and all) so the application involves coffee, wine and beer spills, heat, the odd contact with the Wii mote.

The top is merbau from decking around the house - extremely well seasoned and the legs are meranti (the denser stuff, not the balsa wood type) which I have had kicking around in the garage forever.

So far I have sanded it to about 180 grit and was starting to think how I might finish it (the top in particular). I have read a few threads on ubeaut shellac and was starting to warm to the idea but then I saw some examples of automotive acrylic lacquer (eg http://www.woodworkforums.com/f9/sanding-sealer-109609/#post1093399) and loved the gloss. Since I already have some A/L and can spray it, that is attractive to me, however I have never used it on timber.

Having said that I wasn't necessarily after a high gloss finish, and given the application, I wonder if a more satiny finish might be the go and not show dings as obviously.

If I go down the acrylic lacquer path - what kind of prep would be necessary for the timber (say the PPG sanding sealer mentioned on another thread)?

In any case, I don't want those white rings you get on some finishes when you put a hot mug on it.

Any suggestions will be gratefully sifted through.

cheers

[SynergyInte]

For absolute greatest durability I recommend, a simple old fashioned Urethane. Just as durrable, but requireing more coats I use Verethane Professional Diamond High Gloss. Each coat dries to the touch in a few minuits, can be 00000 steel wool polished to whatever degree you wish the gloss quality. The Verethane is a superior product, just goes on a little thinner each coat, but dries and can be recoated, almost irregardless of humidity conditions.

[sosman]

Thanks for the heads up on the urethane. I was thinking that a urethane finish wouldn't feature the wood as much as I would like (probably same deal with acrylic lacquer) but I have no doubt it will be robust.

Since I posted I have seen an example of a Danish Oil finish in the flesh and that looked quite attractive to me but I'm not sure how durable it would be.

[Tung tied]

The danish, scandanavian and tung oil finishes are not as hard as urethane but make it a lot easier to repair if your table is subject to the normal levels of use and abuse like dents, nicks, scratches and the like. It's just a matter of repair the damage and wipe on some more oil. You don't have to peel or sand off the urethane.

Cheers

Bryan

[China]

Rustins Plastic Coating, once you have tried it and explored the various degrees of finnsh you will love it. No I don't have shares in the company but I should have due to the amount of this stuff I have used over the years.

[Christos]

I know that some people are going to disagree with me but here goes.

Danish oil is a mixture of other oils and solvents I think. I have used the one from Organoil. I have not used this on any surface that is going to be knocked about, again I can not recall but I think it says something like that on the can. It take a long time to dry and if you want to wax the surface it needs to be 14 days wait.

I perfer to use an oil based polyurethane.

[Christos]

And I should add nice work.

No one noticed the holes, the gaps or the contrast that you have so nicely pointed out. :U

[sosman]

I know that some people are going to disagree with me but here goes.

Danish oil is a mixture of other oils and solvents I think. I have used the one from Organoil. I have not used this on any surface that is going to be knocked about, again I can not recall but I think it says something like that on the can. It take a long time to dry and if you want to wax the surface it needs to be 14 days wait.

I perfer to use an oil based polyurethane.

Heh - I just picked up some Organoil Danish oil today from Carba-Tec (before I read your post). I read the label carefully again and it says "don't use for benchtops". They had another oil "buffing oil" I think which now I realise is apparently suitable for benchtops. Is it just me or does it get harder to read the back of the tin as you get older?

I don't know what their policy on returning this stuff is - for all they know I could have emptied the tin and refilled it with sump oil. You live and learn.

[sosman]

I figure I'll give the oil a go - I won't die wondering.

Any tips on how fine to go with the sanding? I have just done it with 400 grit, looks like I will need to go to an automotive paint store if I want finer stuff (for a velcro pad anyway).

[TP1]

I am in the process of completing 2 Jarrah coffee tables. One I used Danish oil - Rustins. I did my own testing and bought several small tins of different types of oil, but the Rustins seemed to give the best feel and touch. After that I thought the other oils were no better than wipe on poly, as they all had polyurethane in them, although Feast Watsons Floorseal was pretty good.

Make no mistake, when wipe on oil finishes are used, the coating is so thin that there is not much protection at all. The saving grace is that they are easier to repair, but some with high poly content are less so.

Since then I have discovered shellac - and it is now my finish of choice. In particular U- Beaut White Shellac. I have found it to show the timber off far better than any other coating I have used. Beautiful rich tones that synthetic finishes (almost everything else) can't seem to match.

In my (limited) experience to date it seems to give better protection than the danish oil. I am sure with sufficient build up the Danish oil surface would improve , but then you may as well just varnish the thing to start with, because the so called danish oils are usually just thinned down varnish ( including polyurethane)

[TP1]

I figure I'll give the oil a go - I won't die wondering.

Any tips on how fine to go with the sanding? I have just done it with 400 grit, looks like I will need to go to an automotive paint store if I want finer stuff (for a velcro pad anyway).

No point sanding the bare wood any finer than 320. You will need to sand after the first coat raises the grain. The poly and other resins that are deposited on the surface when the solvents evaporate will cover 320 grit sanding marks. If you want an ultra smooth and even finish, you may need to fill the grain in the process.

The very fine sanding should be left for finishing at the final stage, although it may be worthwhile doing the occasional light smoothing between coats.

[sosman]

I am in the process of completing 2 Jarrah coffee tables.
Since then I have discovered shellac - and it is now my finish of choice. In particular U- Beaut White Shellac. I have found it to show the timber off far better than any other coating I have used. Beautiful rich tones that synthetic finishes (almost everything else) can't seem to match.

In my (limited) experience to date it seems to give better protection than the danish oil. I am sure with sufficient build up the Danish oil surface would improve , but then you may as well just varnish the thing to start with, because the so called danish oils are usually just thinned down varnish ( including polyurethane)

As far as I can tell, the Organoil product doesn't have urethanes (http://organoil.com.au/danishoil/printable.html).

So how does the hard shellac stand up to hot cups and that kind of thing. I can probably convince adults to use coasters but the kids are another matter.

[corbs]

I have recently become a huge fan of Ubeaut Hard Shellac:2tsup:

I am assuming it will be good on table tops as I plan on using it on the dining table, coffee table and entertainment unit I'm making:)

[TP1]

As far as I can tell, the Organoil product doesn't have urethanes (http://organoil.com.au/danishoil/printable.html).

So how does the hard shellac stand up to hot cups and that kind of thing. I can probably convince adults to use coasters but the kids are another matter.

I think I remember seeing a post by Neil ( U Beaut ) saying that the distributors of Organoil admitted to him that it does contain polyurethane. The problem with Danish oil is that the title is a modern euphemism for thinned varnish (including polyurethane)

As far as hot cups of coffee etc, yes, that is a problem with shellac if no-one uses coasters etc, but shellac is repairable. I haven't tried Hard Shellac yet, but as Corbs has said, it would seem to be the ticket for table tops.

If you do use shellac, I would suggest that you rub the final finish and polish it . Also,my results improved out of sight when I bought a decent size artists mop brush from an art store. It cost over $60 but the results were outstanding and cannot be achieved by conventional paint brushes ( or conventional brushing methods)

[rsser]

+1 to a good brush.

neil also has recommended the Gramercy (http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com/Merchant/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=toolshop&Product_Code=GT-SHEBRU.XX&Category_Code=&Search=brush)brush from Tools for Working with wood. Have got the 2" job but not given it a run yet.

PS As posted elsewhere, an AWR test showed the Organoil Hard Burnishing and Danish oils to be among the most durable in the limited tests done.

I like Rustins DO for my turnings but its fairly dark and not that durable.

Don't like O HBO as it raises the grain several weeks down the track. Not a prob if you're prepared to cut it back.

Don't like O DO as the finish is quite flat but I expect that with some wet sanding and buffing a sheen could be raised.

[TP1]

Thanks Rsser for the link - I will get one of those as well

I forgot to mention that a good polish with quality paste wax such as U Beaut or Gilly Stephenson will add depth and lustre to any finish including polyurethane. This may be a solution if someone is looking for a finish that stands out but wants the ease of application and durability of say wipe on poly.

The polish is done in the final stage when the poly ( gloss) is very finely sanded to remove dust nibs etc, then EEE to bring up the shine and followed by say U Beaut traditional wax. The look is significantly better than just poly which can look a bit plastic. You would do this for the top only and probably wipe on poly satin for the table frame ( it does match the top finish very well due to it being on a vertical surface)

The wax finish lasts a very long time and if scuff marks appear a simple rub will fix it or at worst a bit more polish.

[Christos]

I figure I'll give the oil a go - I won't die wondering.


Since you have already purchased the product then it might be an idea of trying this on a piece of scrap of the same wood so that you can get an idea on what it will look like.

Put some in a seperate cup and use that as the dipping pot. Do not put the left over back in the original tin as it defeats the purpose of seperate pot.

[sosman]

Carba tech kindly allowed me to switch to the hard burnishing oil. I will give it a crack over the weekend.

[TP1]

let us know how you went with the project

[sosman]

Here is what it looks like oiled:

http://brewiki.org/pics/tabletop_oiled.jpg

And here is a close up of the merbau:

http://brewiki.org/pics/graincloseup.jpg

I'm not sure I quite got the hang of the organoil burnishing technique with the sandpaper dust slurry, but the finish is kind of what I had in mind. I haven't put it to use yet, read somewhere it needs a week before pressing into use.

[TP1]

Looking good sosman